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A Fully Automated Imaging Observatory - WIP


steppenwolf

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Isn't it a mesu200 mount you have? I though they went a couple of hours past the meridian before flipping.

The Mesu mount may well do so but the big wide filter carousel on the camera won't as at one altitude and one camera orientation (that I have to allow for), the camera and mount will meet up for a close and personal tête-à-tête!!

I have to say this has been well taken care of for me with ACP.

ACP does seem to be the system of choice but as we've discussed, at such a high price - Janie would just say 'go for it' but that is hardly the point .....

How difficult can it be for the current system to just reverse the commands? :grin: :grin: What is particularly frustrating is that the 'difficult' part of re-aligning the field of view to match the pre-flip images through automatic plate solving and re-acquiring the guide star works seamlessly :huh: If I have to go the ACP route, I guess I will but I am so nearly there at a much lower cost ..... SG Pro will work with the Mesu in this regard but, I'd have to stop using MaxIm DL and replace my observatory PC as it runs Windows XP and I am very reluctant to do so.

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I'm sure there is a solution, and I'm sure you will find it to be something simple(it usually is). I have now added observatory power to my automated system, I have yet to test this in a full run, but after some trial and error - mainly error, everything up to the full shut down works ok - including the flip and restart.

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That's good news, Martin, an excellent achievement.

I am sure you are right about it being something simple hence me 'simplifying' the command chain by the removal of POTH. I thought I had approached this issue in a logical and structured way but the next set of tests will be even better documented - I am going to run logs for the guiding and as well as noting the various settings and rather than just noting 'failed', I'll make a specific note of the error magnitudes of both RA and DEC !! This should help to pin down which permutation of the various settings heads me in the right direction.

Please, weather, cheer up an' gimme a break .........

Good job, I'm enjoying myself even without the imaging!

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Additional Note 14 - NAILED IT -  restarting autoguiding after a meridian flip!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Did I tell you that I had nailed it?

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Nailed it!!

Happy? Oh yeah ....................

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and the problem was ?

Just getting the right set of control permutations and removing POTH from the equation so that MaxIm DL and CCD Commander were directly connected to the mount and dome ASCOM drivers.

There doesn't seem to be anyone else using my exact system but in case there is in the future, these are the parameter settings that worked:-

SiTech

GEM Autoflip GoTo - enable

GEM Auto Flip Track - disable

Reverse Guide Mode when Looking East (Dec) - enable

Reverse RA Guide Mode when Looking East (RA) - disable

Meridian Overlap (Degrees) - 03:45:00

MaxIm DL

Auto Pier Flip - disable

Reverse X -enable

Reverse Y - disable

Use Scope Flip - disable

Thanks to 'gnomus' (a fellow member, Steve, here on SGL) who let me know his basic settings for Sequence Generator Pro, PHD2 and SiTech - I used those as the basis for CCD Commander and MaxIm DL.

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Ah, yes remember talking to 'gnomus' about his flip issues, thought you had got that sussed though.

I have had my obs working for a while but use SGP and some bespoke software/hardware to control it and had have a ROR so much easier, not sure I would have liked trying to get a dome to work. Also no ability to restart after cloud which is a pain . Have looked at ACP but cost puts me off a tad.

Edited by tdnicholls
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Nice one Steve.. that's saved you a few bob. :grin:

Thankfully, it has! :grin: :grin:

Also no ability to restart after cloud which is a pain . Have looked at ACP but cost puts me off a tad.

CCD Commander will do a close down and restart if conditions change although I have not put that fully to the test yet although the close-down works perfectly.

I have just one more thing to test out now - cloud 'management' - and I guess that includes a restart.

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I was prepared to go to great lengths to resolve this issue by a process of careful experimentation and results collation as the following spreadsheet demonstrates - how ironic then that the first permutation was the right one! :grin: :grin: :cool:

post-1029-0-67971800-1446382190_thumb.pn

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I have just one more thing to test out now - cloud 'management' - and I guess that includes a restart.

Good luck with that.. this "season" so far has been the most challenging with the CloudWatcher. I find I'm actively managing the parameters on a daily basis now... things like sky temps looking clear when mist develops low down.. the other week the obsy was opening for 10 mins then shutting then opening like a yoyo.. all night!  It kept reading wet yet the kit was dry.. I went out and the grass was as dry as a bone!!. I think it was dew forming higher up ( I moved the sensors & anemometer higher up on a pole after the false sky temp readings when the roof opened). So nearly 2 years on with it & it's still a bit of a black art tweaking it to suit the seasons. Last night (& tonight) it read totally dry.. and yet all my subs from 04:00 onwards this morning show it was foggy and the kit was still dripping wet at lunchtime when I checked,  I stupidly disabled the dehumidifier to auto start on roof close as I don't normally have a dew problem!

So yeah... the way the good 'ol british weather is going right now.... good luck with that... :laugh:

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I suspect that you are quite right about this being another challenge - I'm getting used to it now!!. Luckily, cloud is not as much of a problem as actual 'rain' and, thus far, the AAG seems to be acting correctly in this regard - wasted images (and lost guide stars) are one thing, wet gear is quite another!

I recall in an earlier post you said that re-calibration through the seasons was a 'must' and I have no doubt that you are right - sadly, because it has taken me all summer to reach this stage, I have only calibrated the system once!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Additional Note 15 - Success with restarting autoguiding after a meridian flip with POTH engaged.

Following my success with re-acquiring a guide star and holding on to it automatically after a meridian flip, I realised that excluding POTH from the control equation made auto-connection of the mount and dome at start-up a little problematic. Tonight was the first opportunity I have had for some time to try the tests again with POTH in line and I am delighted to report that its re-introduction has been seamless.

Not bad tracking either - the peak figures (pixel values) are the result of the dithering between each subframe:-

post-1029-0-29569300-1447453729.png

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Additional Note 16 - Extra hardware project

Some time ago, before I started this project, I was experimenting with remote operation from my home and I bought a USB controlled power strip to allow me to turn ON/OFF up to four AC Mains powered components. The unit I bought was from a company called Energenie and on the face of it, their product was just what I wanted. However, the first unit that arrived 'rattled' as the insides had broken away in transit so although it worked, I was not confident that it would work for long! The replacement unit didn't rattle but it had an intermittent USB port connection so it too went back and I lost confidence in the product. At this point, I decided to call it quits and just go out there and turn everything on manually.

When I started the current automation project, the need for accessory control raised its head again but I could only find IP addressed controllers and this did not really float my boat as I had already decided that a USB solution would make the most sense as, at the end of the day, a PC would always be in operation in the observatory anyway.

The dome rotation/shutter opening system that I use is controlled by a Velleman K8055N USB control board and LesveDome ASCOM driver. A rather nice feature of the LesveDome software is that it comes with a GUI that includes the ability to control a second K8055N USB control board using the ASCOM Switch protocol. This gives the user access to an 8 port USB switch that can control up to 8 circuits using open collector circuitry. A little research found that Velleman also produce an 8 port relay switch unit that will connect directly to the 8 digital ports of the K8055N USB control board and protect it fully. The additional board is rather snappily called a 'VM129' and it can handle up to 5A at 230VAC on each of its 8 relays but as each port is isolated from its neighbours, a mix of connections can be made. This opens up the possibility of switching not only AC mains but, say, 12v or even signal level circuits and this piqued my interest.

My requirements would be neatly served by the following switches:-

1. General Accessory 12v PSU (Mount, Focuser, Flat-Flap, AAG Cloudwatcher)

2. Dome Controller PSU

3. Accessory (12v) switch

4. Camera 1 PSU

5. Camera 2 PSU

6. Observatory Illumination

7. Dehumidifier

8. Intruder Tazer - only joking, (or am I?)

So, with Wake Up On LAN using a 'magic packet' to fire up the PC from anywhere with an Internet connection and the ability of that PC to control all the equipment in the observatory, a new phase begins and the fact that it is pouring with rain again, couldn't matter less - I am having so much fun just fiddling!

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There is a "spare" switch on the original control board, I know you are using one for your "flip flat" unit, I too am using the same port for my flat screen. I have just added a relay to turn on/off the mains power to the scope room - I had the warm room and scope room on separate circuits so it was easy enough to break in to the wiring and add a 2 pole relay, this way I can turn on/off the mount, ccd, and focuser - my filter wheel is USB powerd so stays on with the obs computer.

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Hi Martin,

I have seen that there appear to be three 'spare' ports on the original board

1. one is digital and pre-labelled 'ScopePower'

2. a second is analogue and labelled 'Slider'

3. the third is digital and Channel #7

I am using Channel #7 for the 'flip flat' module and I am assuming that the 'Scope Power' port is identical in operation to Channel #7. I did consider using the ScopePower port to turn on the 12v PSU but that would not power up everything else in the observatory. Your method for turning everything on at once sounds good and for my system, would work well for the CCD Camera with its built in filter-wheel and the SharpSky focus unit as there are no 'ON/OFF' switches for either of these items anyway. However, I want to be sure I don't 'spike' any of the other gear with a start-up surge and in particular, I don't know how reactive the Maplins XM21X PSU is and I would hate to spike the SiTech mount controller which is why I have allowed for items1 and 3 in my list in the earlier post - item 1. turns on the PSU itself, then item 3. connects all the 12v devices to the (now) fully stabilised output of the PSU. I no longer own an oscilloscope (lapsed radio ham!) so can't check to see what appears on the PSU output immediately after switch-on - Perhaps I am worrying unnecessarily here?

With regard to the de-humidifier, my plan was to power this with a N/C output from a beefy relay so that switching on item 7.  would switch the N/C relay to 'open' thus turning off the de-humidifier.

The thought behind item 6. (Observatory Illumination) is that I have a webcam trained on the mount so that I can see what it is up to but in the dark of the observatory, I'd need to illuminate it!

Food for thought, thank you for the suggestion and I hope it works well for you.

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Hi Martin,

I have seen that there appear to be three 'spare' ports on the original board

1. one is digital and pre-labelled 'ScopePower'

2. a second is analogue and labelled 'Slider'

3. the third is digital and Channel #7

I am using Channel #7 for the 'flip flat' module and I am assuming that the 'Scope Power' port is identical in operation to Channel #7. I did consider using the ScopePower port to turn on the 12v PSU but that would not power up everything else in the observatory. Your method for turning everything on at once sounds good and for my system, would work well for the CCD Camera with its built in filter-wheel and the SharpSky focus unit as there are no 'ON/OFF' switches for either of these items anyway. However, I want to be sure I don't 'spike' any of the other gear with a start-up surge and in particular, I don't know how reactive the Maplins XM21X PSU is and I would hate to spike the SiTech mount controller which is why I have allowed for items1 and 3 in my list in the earlier post - item 1. turns on the PSU itself, then item 3. connects all the 12v devices to the (now) fully stabilised output of the PSU. I no longer own an oscilloscope (lapsed radio ham!) so can't check to see what appears on the PSU output immediately after switch-on - Perhaps I am worrying unnecessarily here?

With regard to the de-humidifier, my plan was to power this with a N/C output from a beefy relay so that switching on item 7.  would switch the N/C relay to 'open' thus turning off the de-humidifier.

The thought behind item 6. (Observatory Illumination) is that I have a webcam trained on the mount so that I can see what it is up to but in the dark of the observatory, I'd need to illuminate it!

Food for thought, thank you for the suggestion and I hope it works well for you.

All my obs gear runs off individual 12V supplies so there is no problem for me to just shut off the mains power.

The "Scope Power" port on the main board needs 2 relays to operate as a latch.....as per the wiring diagram on the web site...it uses a feedback to a digital input port to work correctly.....as I found out!

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All my obs gear runs off individual 12V supplies so there is no problem for me to just shut off the mains power.

Right, I have a single 12v (actually 13.8v) PSU that runs the mount, focuser, weather monitor and 'flat-flap' a second unit that powers the azimuth controller and a solar charged 12v Battery that runs the aperture controller - I was going to leave the latter on 'permanently' when anticipating total unattended operation. Of course, most of the time I will be operating 'remotely' but from within my home so a quick trip out to the observatory to turn everything on manually would be my normal way of doing things.

The "Scope Power" port on the main board needs 2 relays to operate as a latch

Oh does it indeed! I wonder why they have written the LesveDome control software like that rather than just make it a 'simple' switch like Ch #7? Not difficult to resolve though as you have discovered.

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It actually uses 2 ports to latch, one to turn on and one to turn off, with a manual over ride, I think the 2 ports and 2 relays may be there to as a failsafe............. It stays latched until it recieves an OFF command ...the power stays on if the computer fails, perhaps. (as yet untested), I may fire it up tomorrow and pull the USB lead and see what happens!

http://www.dppobservatory.net/ROR/ED-ROR-V04.pdf

Relays K1, K2 leading on to K3....this is the circuit I use........ 2 x 12V relays operating a 230V relay for power switching

Edited by martin_h
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Thanks for that wiring diagram, Martin, ironically I haven't seen that one - I must have skipped it as it was for a ROR but there is some useful information in there. My aperture control is similar in most respects but my current flow direction control is different as you can see below:-

post-1029-0-68436400-1448126875_thumb.pn

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Additional Note 17 - Bug in FocusMax Version 3.8.0.20

I sometimes feel that astrophotography is a case of one step forwards, two steps back and that has certainly been the case at times with this project! However, as anyone reading the account of this project will have realised, I don't give up easily! So, the latest issue to raise its head:-

I have discovered a bug in FocusMax 3.0.8.20 that has been confirmed by the developer but the only solution offered is to buy the latest version (V4) at $149.95 !! This may not seem like a lot of money but the version I have was free and I have implemented a self-imposed cap on any further expenditure on this project apart from the acceptance of family gifts at Christmas and birthdays where I have a small list including the control boards mention in post #140! :grin:

The night before last, I was running a test session and re-focusing every 30 minutes using AcquireStar in FocusMax. The original focus run and the first re-focus at 30 minutes into the session ran perfectly. However, the second re-focus at 1 hour into the session, failed to focus on any of the three stars suggested by PinPoint. A second AcquireStar run then started automatically and successfully carried out a focus run BUT instead of returning to the original coordinates, the telescope was directed to return to the location of the last failed potential focus star and my system happily imaged for the rest of session in the wrong place!!!! On a positive note, the area it imaged was perfectly in focus so if anyone wants an image of a random star, let me know!

SOLUTIONS

1. spend more money

2. find a free work-around

Here's the free solution:-

To ensure that focus is maintained throughout an imaging session despite temperature changes, I arrange for a re-focus to take place automatically every 30 minutes. This is carried out by a CCD Commander sub-action that focuses using the Luminance filter, selects the correct filter and applies an offset if required, captures ‘n’ images and repeats the sequence ‘nn’ times. All I need to do is add a third command - between these two command sets - that instructs the mount to move to the original object's RA/DEC. This information is already recorded by CCD Commander at the start of the session so it is easy to implement.

It is rare for focus to fail with the choice of three suitable stars supplied by PinPoint (in fact this is the first time I have seen it fail) but my work-around will catch it if it ever happens again and the worst case scenario is that I will simply waste a small mount correction if there is no fail. However, I will always be pointing at the right object!

Master Action

post-1029-0-82057500-1448211934.png

Focus and Image Capture Sub-Action

post-1029-0-13752000-1448211978.png

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  • 3 weeks later...

Additional Note 18 - Finally a fully automated session including a meridian flip

A break in the awful cloudy skies on the night of 07 - 08 December gave me an opportunity to continue with the final testing phase. I managed 12 subframes of 600 seconds of Ha on the Rosette Nebula before cloud forced an automatic close-down but frustratingly this occurred before the system had completed a meridian flip so this remained untested as part of a fully scripted imaging run.

However, the next night was even clearer and FLO's 'Clear Outside' app had good news so I set another fully automated run in progress to capture OIII data from the same object. Despite some dome tracking issues (yet to be fully resolved) earlier in the evening while waiting for the Rosette to rise, this run went perfectly and whilst I was in the 'land of nod', a refocus was carried out every hour, a meridian flip with re-acquisition of the guide star was completed without a hitch (according to the log) and a well-mannered close-down including incremental warming up of the camera's sensor took place.

So, a fully automated imaging session including meridian flip has now been completed satisfactorily and I'm starting to collect worthwhile image data again ........

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