Considering first telescope, want to upgrade later

[Sven Buttler]

Good morning

I've finally started reading up on the various telescope types out there
and I have to say it's not for the faint hearted.

I almost jumped the gun and went for a DOB 8", which is fairly inexpensive
but I would almost certainly want to get into astrophotography at some
point, and while I'm sure the DOB would be great for observing, from
what I understand a Newton is the better choice here.

From what I've read so far a good mount is as important as the tube itself,
and it appears many of the telescopes come with a stock mount thats inadequate
in one way or another. I've also read that for beginning astrophotographers,
a smaller tube is what you want, so I'm considering buying a sturdy mount
like an EQ6 that will last me a few years, and go for one of the smaller
Newtons, e.g. Skywatcher 150/750. The standalone tube goes for € 240, and
I can probably resell it later.

Bugdet is € 2000.
Any advice or suggestions?

Best regards,
Sven
 

[kalasinman]

Perfectly sound logic in my opinion. One thing I really like about my 150mm Newtonian is the FOV frames many of the common targets very nicely. Not ready for mosaics here.

[Comsat]

I followed the same logic as you - skip the beginners section if you're serious about it - and get a mixture of biggest aperture / best mount you can afford - that's the advice I got from browsing SGL for months and speaking to Dave at FLO.

I settled for SkyWatcher 200P with EQ5 mount as my budget was a bit more humble and I still needed to get eyepieces, adapters, and a camera but I can easily recommend it - great views, and decent pictures. I know that for Astroimaging the EQ6 will be so much better, but even my EQ5 is doing a very good job and you'll find lots of people taking amazing photos with that setup ( I think it's rather popular due to price/possibilities ratio ).

So I think your plan sounds good. The SkyWatcher 150mm or 200mm will do you great service - not only they're great scopes, but they also have the direct SLR connection to make your life quite a bit easier. Combine it with EQ5 or better and you'll be fine. Probably worth getting 1-2 eyepieces as well, and unfortunately, the accessories needed to start taking photos are quite expensive as well, but with budget like that you won't have any problems and it's really worth it.

Hope this helps somehow

[Sven Buttler]

Thanks guys, really appreciated

[happy-kat]

The P-DS range is attuned to imaging direction much more I gather from reading posts then the straight P (p for parabolic). The primary mirror is better positioned for imaging and other stuff.

[dweller25]

Hello Sven, welcome to SGL.

You could always buy a Dobsonian and then later buy an Equatorial mount like I did ......

[RichM63]

Be slightly wary about absorbing old threads, I have the feeling that the 'flavour' has changed a little over the years. 

EQ6 great idea, APO refractor for imaging even better than a reflector for AP.

I have both the 150 and 200 and am very happy with them + my DSLR in sig', but I am not remotely in the same league as the dedicated AP guys.

Generally its all about managing expectations and pushing the boundaries where possible.

Speak also to the guys at Telescope Service in Germany, they are very helpful.

Best of luck,

Rich

[kalasinman]

Be slightly wary about absorbing old threads, I have the feeling that the 'flavour' has changed a little over the years. 

EQ6 great idea, APO refractor for imaging even better than a reflector for AP.

I have both the 150 and 200 and am very happy with them + my DSLR in sig', but I am not remotely in the same league as the dedicated AP guys.

Generally its all about managing expectations and pushing the boundaries where possible.

Speak also to the guys at Telescope Service in Germany, they are very helpful.

Best of luck,

Rich

As a "dedicated AP guy" I would dispute that refractors are better for AP. There are points in their favor, and lovely images can be taken with them, but there are indisputable advantages to mirror based systems over lens based systems. Chromatic Aberrition is unavoidable to some degree in lens based systems.

The whole debate about this has been re-visited to excess, so not going there. I suggest you research both sides of this and see what seems best for you.

[Charic]

You seem to have done  some homework already, and quite set in your requirements. Dobsonians are great for visual use, but not so good for photographic requirements, due to the mounting system? Thread #6 above  does show  that a 'Dobsonian'  can be mounted to an EQ system, but do note that the  Dobsonian itself is not a telescope, but the mounting system to support the telescope. Your still using a Newtonian telescope. I have sent you a PM with further info.

[Sven Buttler]

Hello Sven, welcome to SGL.

You could always buy a Dobsonian and then later buy an Equatorial mount like I did ......

Hello David,

thanks, that looks impressive, but I'm afraid its a bit too huge for my current apartment, thats why I tend toward one of the smaller reflectors (or refractors for that matter).

Best regards

Sven

[Sven Buttler]

You seem to have done  some homework already, and quite set in your requirements. Dobsonians are great for visual use, but not so good for photographic requirements, due to the mounting system? Thread #6 above  does show  that a 'Dobsonian'  can be mounted to an EQ system, but do note that the  Dobsonian itself is not a telescope, but the mounting system to support the telescope. Your still using a Newtonian telescope. I have sent you a PM with further info.

Thanks for the PM. And yes, of course you're right the tube itself is a Newtonian reflector.

I understand you can mount the Dobson tube on a mount with a guiding system but there's also the size to consider. I will probably be moving

within the next two years, but currently I'm living in a tiny apartment and accomodating a 6" will be a challenge, let alone an 8 incher.

Best regards,

Sven

[Sven Buttler]

Thanks for the PM. And yes, of course you're right the tube itself is a Newtonian reflector.

I understand you can mount the Dobson tube on a mount with a guiding system but there's also the size to consider. I will probably be moving

within the next two years, but currently I'm living in a tiny apartment and accomodating a 6" will be a challenge, let alone an 8 incher.

Best regards,

Sven

Mh not sure how to edit messages.. my last post didn't make a whole lot of sense. Of course I could go for a dedicated 6" DOB

and strap it on to a EQ mount

[happy-kat]

You will get the edit function at 250 posts I think it is :-)

If you know you want to image at some point then I would check to make sure the tube you chose is well suited to imaging you can't stick a camera onto any telescope and image some might not be able to reach focus and others are very long and suffer being blown around.

Not seen it mentioned above but you might like to add the book Making Every Proton Count in to your list.

[Akiainavas]

I would recommend the SkyWatcher 200/250p with EQ5 or EQ6 mount depending on what you want to do later. A GOTO mount is not necessary to begin with - you won't be able to get long exposures, but you can surely start without it - and you can always upgrade later. Also, would suggest spending the rest on a set of decent eyepieces, adapters - and a camera if you don't have one. Canon EOS 100D is worth recommending - brilliant pictures for the price. Oh and I'd recommend you go for Baader Hyperion eyepieces - their modular design allows you to experiment with many different focal lengths for a really low price and you can get an adapter and hook up your camera directly to the eyepiece for eyepiece projection photography. Lots of possibilities for relatively low amount of money.

[garryblueboy]

Skywatcher np190 great image scope .

[Helite]

You say you "almost certainly" want to get into AP, so like most others on here I would suggest reading this book first http://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/making-every-photon-count-steve-richards.html before committing to any gear.

I can only give an opinion based on my limited knowledge but if I had your 2k to spend on kit I would probably go with a HEQ5 mount with an 80ED  http://www.firstlightoptics.com/pro-series/skywatcher-evostar-80ed-pro-heq5-pro.html

I would also buy a 130PDS or 150PDS to stick on the mount too http://www.firstlightoptics.com/reflectors/skywatcher-explorer-150p-ds-ota.html 

That would leave enough money over for a camera and other bits and bobs that you will find you need along the way when you start. From experience I would NOT recommend buying an EQ5, I have one, its a good mount, but not very good for AP with a larger scope, you will just end up upgrading eventually so best just biting the bullet and investing in a heavier mount straight away.

There is fairly good eyepieces available at decent prices as well, but I wouldn't bother with any until you get a scope and find out what will work best with whatever you choose, the supplied eyepieces will keep you amused until you work out what you want. 

There are some good threads with images taken with the scopes I mentioned, the ED80  http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/236987-what-can-the-skywatcher-evostar-ed80-do-for-me/ and the 130PDS http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/210593-imaging-with-the-130pds/ that 2 threads should give you an idea of the capability of both scopes.

Anyway hope that helps you some.

[Sven Buttler]

You say you "almost certainly" want to get into AP, so like most others on here I would suggest reading this book first http://www.firstlightoptics.com/books/making-every-photon-count-steve-richards.html before committing to any gear.

I can only give an opinion based on my limited knowledge but if I had your 2k to spend on kit I would probably go with a HEQ5 mount with an 80ED  http://www.firstlightoptics.com/pro-series/skywatcher-evostar-80ed-pro-heq5-pro.html

I would also buy a 130PDS or 150PDS to stick on the mount too http://www.firstlightoptics.com/reflectors/skywatcher-explorer-150p-ds-ota.html

That would leave enough money over for a camera and other bits and bobs that you will find you need along the way when you start. From experience I would NOT recommend buying an EQ5, I have one, its a good mount, but not very good for AP with a larger scope, you will just end up upgrading eventually so best just biting the bullet and investing in a heavier mount straight away.

There is fairly good eyepieces available at decent prices as well, but I wouldn't bother with any until you get a scope and find out what will work best with whatever you choose, the supplied eyepieces will keep you amused until you work out what you want. 

There are some good threads with images taken with the scopes I mentioned, the ED80  http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/236987-what-can-the-skywatcher-evostar-ed80-do-for-me/ and the 130PDS http://stargazerslounge.com/topic/210593-imaging-with-the-130pds/ that 2 threads should give you an idea of the capability of both scopes.

Anyway hope that helps you some.

Thanks, I already came across the ED80 yesterday, looking for advice on reflector vs refractor with regards to AP. In fact thats the very thread I was looking at, fantastic images a lot better than what I expected from a 80mm aperture device. When I look at those nebula images I'm wondering why the recommend against it on the Astroshop website, its certainly more than capable for my needs but then I don't have any first hand experience other than my binos.

As for eye pieces and other accessories, thats something for later, looking at the EQ6 manual, it looks like I will spend a fair amount of time to get this to work.

[Sven Buttler]

Tried to order Make every Photon count online, but the website wouldn't let me checkout. I'll send them an email, hopefully we can sort it out.

[Helite]

Probably due to shipping to Germany http://www.firstlightoptics.com/delivery-information.html

Drop them a mail, they are always very helpful in my experience.

[Sven Buttler]

Yes, they said I have to contact Steve which I did.

One further question on the EQ6 mount if I may, can you still operate it manually or do you always have to use the GoTo feature?

[Helite]

You can point the EQ6 anywhere you want with the hand controller or a laptop. But there is no slow-motion controls like you have on a manual mount which I think is what your asking. But you can use the hand controller to move the scope into any position and it will track once set.