The "No EQ" DSO Challenge!

[parallaxerr]

Well the weather didn't exactly play ball tonight but I got my experiment done and I'm really happy with the result. Had a window of about 1.5hrs to image and grabbed 59m30s of decent subs.

M42. WO ZS66SD, Baader MPCC & semi-apo filter and ISO800. 119 x30s subs, 50 dark, 50 flat, 50 dark flat.

Bashed this though startools as fast as I could - Autodev, wipe, autodev, crop, bin 50%, colour, de-noise. That's it, left most settings as standard then upped the brightness and contrast a touch in GIMP. There's a slight green to the stars, probably from the filter buy boy do I prefer an apo, bye bye CA! It's obvious I need more subs with the smaller scope but that's fine, I'll keep adding to them now. Much better FOV too, think my mind's made up on which scope I'll be sticking to imaging with and keeping the ST120 for DSO visual (if I ever look through it again!).

Only downside is a touch of coma top corners which the ST120 didn't suffer with, maybe there's a little tilt in the WO focuser?

P.S. Calibrated my monitor today, hopefully I'm now seeing the same images as you guys, the gamma was waaaaay off!

 

Edited November 13, 2016 by parallaxerr

[The Admiral]

Very nice Jon, good to see a complete arc and the Running Man as well. True, an APO does give you one less hassle. It would be interesting to see how much difference the filter actually makes.

And to think that you weren't sure about taking up AP with your gear! I hope that you find the experience encouraging.

Ian

[Nigel G]

StarTool users, A question for you.

Can I go back to undo a done thing, previous to the undo tab if you know what I mean ??

In other words can I undo 2 applied mods. or do I have to start again....

Edit. Can I get a log of whats been done otherwise ?

Edit Edit, found it in the startools folder  

Nige

Edited November 13, 2016 by Nigel G

[The Admiral]

Thinks! Would I be right in saying that if you 'restore' it'll offer a number of previous stages to select from? I haven't ST handy to check at the mo.

Ian

Edit. I've also added to a feature request on the ST Forum to automate the log file actions. Any support there would be helpful! http://forum.startools.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1039 

Edited November 13, 2016 by The Admiral

[Nigel G]

I too had a while on M42 with my LP filter. Tracking was great for the first 45 subs but then it would not track well at all, even after re aligning. I spent the next hour n half dumping subs, finally it started tracking again but the target had rotated to much to carry on where I left off so that was that. After 2 hours I only got 45 good 30 second subs. with flat dark and bias.

So this is 22 minutes of 30s. with LP filter canon 1300D at 1600 ISO 150P Alt-AZ, DSS & ST.  Still gradients visible lower left, If I had got my intended 1.5 hours that would not be a problem !

There's a very noticeable blue to the stars with the filter.

I don't think this is quite as nice as my first but it is only 44 subs and 22 minutes compared to 120 subs and 30 minutes. The shorter subs seem to be better on the bright M42, maybe it's the filter but there's more in the first attempt without the filter. 

Managed to keep the running man in shot, would have lost it to rotation if I had carried on. 

I found a way to remove refraction spikes today so rotating the camera should not be a problem now so adding subs should be straight forward and the Bahtinov mask is great, focusing is so easy

Cheers

Nige.

First, with LP, 2nd without.

 

[Nigel G]

28 minutes ago, The Admiral said:

Thinks! Would I be right in saying that if you 'restore' it'll offer a number of previous stages to select from? I haven't ST handy to check at the mo.

Ian

Edit. I've also added to a feature request on the ST Forum to automate the log file actions. Any support there would be helpful! http://forum.startools.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1039 

Thanks Ian.

The restore tab was not highlighted so could not use it for some reason.

Nige.

[DorsetBlue]

On 09/11/2016 at 20:20, Nigel G said:

Using a barlow will shorten the possible exposure times by about 50% and also reduce the amount of photons reaching the sensor, I think your better off at prime focus and then cropping to required size.

Good to get 30s with a x2 barlow WD

Still good images though  

Nige.

I cannot use prime focus with my existing telescopes with the DSLR (but do with the GPCAM), neither have sufficient inward travel.

[Nigel G]

5 minutes ago, DorsetBlue said:

I cannot use prime focus with my existing telescopes with the DSLR (but do with the GPCAM), neither have sufficient inward travel.

Ah ok, I had the same problem so had to modify the focuser.

There is a ultra thin T ring available which allows a further 8mm of travel I think..... Looking for link

Nige

[Nigel G]

17 minutes ago, DorsetBlue said:

I cannot use prime focus with my existing telescopes with the DSLR (but do with the GPCAM), neither have sufficient inward travel.

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/adapters/baader-ultra-short-canon-eos-t-ring.html

 

[happy-kat]

Power issues sorted. It's very light, appears well made, pretty small and has a good 10 hours charge. No beans so lentils will do, came with a very strong fixing strap if want to attach to tripod leg (not in shot). Power cord plenty long enough for me and it has other functions so pretty versatile home use as well. 

 

[The Admiral]

On 12/11/2016 at 12:40, Nigel G said:

I'm totally lost in all this, I didn't realise there was so much to it, so many differences with every camera. I really don't understand at all.

Hi Nige, I've been reading some articles which seem to explain the issues rather well. They are by Craig Stark and can be found on his website: http://www.stark-labs.com/craig/articles/articles.html

The relevant ones (Parts 1-5) are from 2009, "Signal to Noise".

Ian

[SteveNickolls]

Thanks for the link Ian, I've just begun reading part 1.

Cheers,
Steve

[Nigel G]

Hi guy's

I have been working on a YouTube channel , Alt-AZ Astrophotography. for a day or so and would like your opinions, maybe how to improve and suggest videos to post or even if its worth it.

So far I have uploaded a few processing video's and a showcase video.

I'm planning to post video's on type of kit and capturing images.

Here's a link if your interested

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCchMWf52QIubmbDcXYOP1Bw

I would appreciate your honest opinions.

Thanks for the link Ian, going to read it now.

Cheers

Nige.

 

[Nigel G]

On ‎15‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 14:35, The Admiral said:

Hi Nige, I've been reading some articles which seem to explain the issues rather well. They are by Craig Stark and can be found on his website: http://www.stark-labs.com/craig/articles/articles.html

The relevant ones (Parts 1-5) are from 2009, "Signal to Noise".

Ian

Thanks for the link, very interesting.

I'm certainly starting to understand the different types of noise and how to address them  

Measuring the camera is a great idea, I had no idea this was possible.

I have a fair bit to read still though.

Cheers

Nige.

[happy-kat]

That's a lovely way to present your images Nige

Might I suggest to add to the info screen at the beginning that you did have to modify the 150p in order to acheive focus with a dslr.

Edited November 17, 2016 by happy-kat
Doh n is not n if it has an i

[Nigel G]

4 hours ago, happy-kat said:

That's a lovely way to present your images Neil.

Might I suggest to add to the info screen at the beginning that you did have to modify the 150p in order to acheive focus with a dslr.

I have added that note in the channel description, thanks for pointing that out

This is exactly the reason I asked for your opinions

Thanks

Nige.

[LukeSkywatcher]

Loving this thread. It has inspired me to dabble in AP in 2017 without the use of an EQ mount. 

[happy-kat]

Nige if doing separate videos I think one for each focal length or rather one for wide using short camera lens, one for mid with camera lenses then long using telescope. A video on just using a camera and tip on aiming it might be good.

After that the viewer will have enough to get going on their own, I do think the self journey is the only real way to learn.

[happy-kat]

I think there are two common misconceptions, first you can only image DSO with an eq mount and the second you can only image DSO if you use a telescope.

So much easier to ditch the telescope and learn first with a camera and lens. You drastically reduce weight and they'll be no focus issues and you'll work with a much more manageable focal length.

The caveat of course is with altaz and camera or telescope imaging the pot of DSO objects is not limitless but you can make a good start into exploring what you can do. It's about making the most of the kit you already have to help decide where you might go next.  Reading helps but there is nothing like doing.

[The Admiral]

10 hours ago, LukeSkywatcher said:

Loving this thread. It has inspired me to dabble in AP in 2017 without the use of an EQ mount. 

Great to hear Paul and good luck for 2017!

Ian

[Filroden]

On 11/15/2016 at 18:58, Nigel G said:

Hi guy's

I have been working on a YouTube channel , Alt-AZ Astrophotography. for a day or so and would like your opinions, maybe how to improve and suggest videos to post or even if its worth it.

So far I have uploaded a few processing video's and a showcase video.

I'm planning to post video's on type of kit and capturing images.

Here's a link if your interested

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCchMWf52QIubmbDcXYOP1Bw

I would appreciate your honest opinions.

Thanks for the link Ian, going to read it now.

Cheers

Nige.

 

I've just watched the star spike removal video (sorry, I had to turn off the music!) and I had two thoughts:

- when you used lasso to mask the spikes, at first I thought you were being very inaccurate with the lasso until you completed the heal and I saw that you didn't need to be very accurate! Maybe worth pointing that out

- you could put a process step list in a smaller font in one of the corners so the viewers can see the steps you're taking, letting the list build down as you start each step - stops you needing to focus too much on which options your mouse is selecting

e.g. 1) Use Lasso tool to roughly mask spikes

2) Use Heal tool with xxx option

[Nigel G]

3 hours ago, Filroden said:

I've just watched the star spike removal video (sorry, I had to turn off the music!) and I had two thoughts:

- when you used lasso to mask the spikes, at first I thought you were being very inaccurate with the lasso until you completed the heal and I saw that you didn't need to be very accurate! Maybe worth pointing that out

- you could put a process step list in a smaller font in one of the corners so the viewers can see the steps you're taking, letting the list build down as you start each step - stops you needing to focus too much on which options your mouse is selecting

e.g. 1) Use Lasso tool to roughly mask spikes

2) Use Heal tool with xxx option

Thanks for your input, sorry about the music, I was thinking of removing it anyway, the options are very limited on the video editor I have. 

With the lasso I thought that roughly masking would be sufficient without explaining. 

I didn't realise I had missed the module and parameter text , I have mentioned them in part 3 of processing M42, that's where my mistake is 

Good idea to list the steps as they are performed. 

Thanks again.

Nige 

[david maitland]

Removed. My apologies

Edited November 18, 2016 by david maitland

[Filroden]

3 hours ago, david maitland said:

M82 taken with an 8" lx90, it isn't very recent. It's something like 10 x140sec lights along with calibration frames. Processed in images +.  Best one I capture with an alt. Az. Since moved on to an Eq.

How did you manage to track for 140s at that focal length? Or did you mean 140 x 10s lights?

[david maitland]

You know what fildroden i'm going to remove this post, i completely forgot the telescope was fixed to a milburn wedge.

My apologies