Before light pollution.

[ollypenrice]

I take Nick's point but the photo seems odd to me. I'm not sure what I'm looking at.

While gratuitous light pollution is foolish, all is not lost. I live within 25 minutes of 3 supermarkets, a builders' merchant, IT shop, shoes shops, jewellers, etc etc. But I have a mag 7 zenith for those with young eyes and the Mlky way shines from horizon to horizon. WHat is perhaps even better is that local authorities are realizing that they have a marketable treasure here and are working to capitalize on it by turning off lights etc.

Olly

[foundaplanet]

We are all suppose to be making our homes and business more energy efficient to contribute to bringing down the countries carbon footprint and we still burn energy for no real purpose when the most of us are sleeping.. The energy companies are hardly going to want that to alter are they.

Hey ho, I really used to get annoyed by the c​ontradictions of it all but alas, I did at some point finally settle with... as a collective our default setting is stupid.

[ollypenrice]

It is indeed. When this was discussed on Radio 4 once, they interviewed people who clearly thought it was RIDICULOUS to imagine not stepping out into fully lit streets. I mean HOW COULD YOU SEE? IT'S DANGEROUS! WHAT WOULD WE DO, HAVE TORCHES BY THE BACK DOOR OR SOMETHING?

Actually, Yes. That is exactly what you would do. It's what we do. It's perfectly normal since darkness is natural, and good for you. Destroying the natural rhythm of day and night is very unhealthy, both physically and mentally.

Olly

[foundaplanet]

Absolutely. Just another one of those things that we know is wrong for all of us but would be no good for financial wealth..

Alexei Sayle summed it up well in this Radio 2 series recently..

[PlanetGazer]

It is indeed. When this was discussed on Radio 4 once, they interviewed people who clearly thought it was RIDICULOUS to imagine not stepping out into fully lit streets. I mean HOW COULD YOU SEE? IT'S DANGEROUS! WHAT WOULD WE DO, HAVE TORCHES BY THE BACK DOOR OR SOMETHING?

Actually, Yes. That is exactly what you would do. It's what we do. It's perfectly normal since darkness is natural, and good for you. Destroying the natural rhythm of day and night is very unhealthy, both physically and mentally.

Olly

Absolutely! Unfortunatly not many is aware of this, the only way to get their approval is by raising awareness.

[rowan46]

99.9% of the population think Milky Way refers to a chocolate bar!

I must admit I thought it was a chocolate bar too

[foundaplanet]

Absolutely! Unfortunatly not many is aware of this, the only way to get their approval is by raising awareness.

That would be a grand idea but for some inexplicable reason something we seem to not want to encourage, 'tis safer to have us all sitting before a tele..

[PlanetGazer]

99.9% of the population think Milky Way refers to a chocolate bar!

I must admit the name is part of the problem

[Wyvern]

Bang on PlanetGazer......... raising people's awareness of the problem and in many cases, the simple solutions, is the way to go. Ignorance is bliss is many cases unfortunately.! On the plus side, many people and organisations will alter lighting once they understand the light pollution issues..... and after they realise that with the more efficient use of the lights, it could actually save them money.... always a good incentive!

[rowan46]

To be honest I don't think awareness is the answer. Frankly even if they knew people wouldn't care. people feel safer with street lighting. They think security lights deter burglars and although some studies show it isn't true they will not believe it. It's obvious isn't it that burglars and criminals don't like the light. I mean all these security people wouldn't sell these things if they were not any good. I agree with an earlier poster that if you put people into groups their default position is stupid

[Scooot]

Yes there's more awareness now than a few years ago. Just have to keep plugging away at it and it will gradually improve.

[PlanetGazer]

To be honest I don't think awareness is the answer. Frankly even if they knew people wouldn't care. people feel safer with street lighting. They think security lights deter burglars and although some studies show it isn't true they will not believe it. It's obvious isn't it that burglars and criminals don't like the light. I mean all these security people wouldn't sell these things if they were not any good. I agree with an earlier poster that if you put people into groups their default position is stupid

I'm sure that we got along before the invention light bulb. Yes it has affected the way we live in the last 200 years or so, but we managed to do it before why can't we do it now? if there's a will there's a way.

The awareness should not cover the disadvantages of light pollution only, but also how to tackle the safety issue, and to be honest the issue have a physiological side to it. I mean there are plenty of communities that live in remote villages with low lighting and don't have an issue with security.

[ollypenrice]

I would like to do an experiment. I would set up a bright security light (using the term as the vendors of this rubbish use it) pointing at the street from a front door in a busy neighbourhood near a good pub. I would then like to spend several hours slowly sawing through the front door while the pub's clientele walked past. You know very well where I'm going with this. I believe that the blinding light would be the perfect camouflage.

Factories with blazing security lights. You want to break in? Arrive with a few more blinding lights, point them out at the street. Enjoy.

Olly

[helicalwave]

Light pollution is here to stay I reckon. 99.9% of the population couldn't give a stuff if they could see the Milky Way or not........

Reducing light pollution sold as reducing energy/energy bills would get the ball rolling, and then once people saw what was out there they might care more about it.

[foundaplanet]

Yes there's more awareness now than a few years ago. Just have to keep plugging away at it and it will gradually improve.

I'm sure that we got along before the invention light bulb. Yes it has affected the way we live in the last 200 years or so, but we managed to do it before why can't we do it now? if there's a will there's a way.

The awareness should not cover the disadvantages of light pollution only, but also how to tackle the safety issue, and to be honest the issue have a physiological side to it. I mean there are plenty of communities that live in remote villages with low lighting and don't have an issue with security.

Aye, I wish you were right, sadly we do not function like that. I used to think we would... well.... you know.... do the obvious things that would make for a better world. I thought wow, I am growing up in an age where we are switched on...ha, didn't happen, there are more scars and fractures appearing by the year and we do nowt... 'Tis the way we are, destructive by nature, won't change.. I mean, already looking at mining asteroids...endless needs for dosh to fulfill the lonely place most people can't cope with... the self.... At the end of the day we are running from our own existence because we can't cope with being. There is a lot of evidence which suggests that artificial light has a large effect on the trigger for breast cancer along with other diseases but we don't do cause we do cure it suits for obvious reasons and I suppose helps give purpose in our great need to prove our blind brilliance..

[Daddystu]

Aye, I wish you were right, sadly we do not function like that. I used to think we would... well.... you know.... do the obvious things that would make for a better world. I thought wow, I am growing up in an age where we are switched on...ha, didn't happen, there are more scars and fractures appearing by the year and we do nowt... 'Tis the way we are, destructive by nature, won't change.. I mean, already looking at mining asteroids...endless needs for dosh to fulfill the lonely place most people can't cope with... the self.... At the end of the day we are running from our own existence because we can't cope with being. There is a lot of evidence which suggests that artificial light has a large effect on the trigger for breast cancer along with other diseases but we don't do cause we do cure it suits for obvious reasons and I suppose helps give purpose in our great need to prove our blind brilliance..

Someones been brushing up on his Sartre

[foundaplanet]

Someones been brushing up on his Sartre

[Scooot]

Aye, I wish you were right, sadly we do not function like that. I used to think we would... well.... you know.... do the obvious things that would make for a better world. I thought wow, I am growing up in an age where we are switched on...ha, didn't happen, there are more scars and fractures appearing by the year and we do nowt... 'Tis the way we are, destructive by nature, won't change.. I mean, already looking at mining asteroids...endless needs for dosh to fulfill the lonely place most people can't cope with... the self.... At the end of the day we are running from our own existence because we can't cope with being. There is a lot of evidence which suggests that artificial light has a large effect on the trigger for breast cancer along with other diseases but we don't do cause we do cure it suits for obvious reasons and I suppose helps give purpose in our great need to prove our blind brilliance..

it will improve, even if gradually, you have to believe in it and as I say keep plugging away at at it.

[emadmoussa]

Blimey, that made me cringe.

[PlanetGazer]

Just wanted to share this with ya http://www.need-less.org.uk, sorry for getting this old topic back.

Some have argued that people won't turn lights off when not needed as it may make them feel safe at night. Maybe that's ok if the lights were to be pointed and concentrated down at where it should be , 1. it'll light more down at the streets so they can see more or feel safe etc..  , 2. save energy 3. and most importantly for us, reduce light pollution. It's all presented in the link above, we just need to share it more.

[PlanetGazer]

Disgusting! 

Not sure how to use this in my signature  

<embed src="http://www.need-less.org.uk/images/need-less-animation.swf" width="300"
height="150"></embed> 


 

[Scooot]

Out of interest where us that, is it Riyadh?

[Alien 13]

Light pollution seems like its here to stay but it does look to me if it will get considerably worse, the switch to LED lighting is a realy bad move as it cant be filtered at least the sodium lights gave us a fighting chance.

The technology exists to eliminate the need for car headlights and blanket motorway lighting so its "logical" that we end up having both and why if we realy must have street lighting cant they have a night mode that turns them to a red wavelength that can be filtered.

Alan

[DaveS]

Out of interest where us that, is it Riyadh?

Inefficient and misdirected light causing sky glow. (Photo taken at Downham, Essex, looking across Wickford)

Copied from the Need-Less site.

[PlanetGazer]

Out of interest where us that, is it Riyadh?

lol, I've been in the UK for 9 years, just moved out, kind of got used to living there  

but "us" in my previous post is for everyone in this forum and all around the world. If this succeeds in a country it'll propagate further.