About to buy a Celestron 9.25 EDGE HD!

[philwright66]

Having used my SW 180 mak for 3 years now,i have decided to go for one of the best planetary imaging scopes available. i have researched the normal C9.25 as well as the EDGE HD version and decided to go with the latest design due to all the positive reviews. I have a CG5 non-goto which should cope with the weight reasonably well,since it will mainly be used for high-res planetary imaging which doesn't really cause the mount to struggle too much. I also have a C6 grab and go super-sharp sct which is great for quick sessions between clouds,as well as a huge cumbersome Orion Optics VX10L which my mount just about handles.Ideally though ,i need something small compact but which will pack a punch so the celestron 9.25 edge hd is the one!

Cheers,Phil

[faulksy]

congrats mate. when are you getting it ? look foward to your first light report

[philwright66]

Cheers, i should have it next week sometime. Just getting the funds together now. I'm thinking that i may buy it from Telescope Service in Germany since it is £600 less than the uk rrp at the gbp/euro current exchange rates.Even from the USA it would work out a lot less than the UK distributer's(David Hinds) rrp. Not sure about warranty issues though.May or may not be worth the risk!

Thanks again,Phil

[neil phillips]

Hi Phil, what F ratio is the vx10 does l stand f6.3. Ive always found the f6.3s seem to perform better on planets than the f4.7, there can be many reasons for this though, some user expertise collimation ect. whatever the reason, if yours is a f6.3 im surprised your not concentrating on imaging with it.

I have found my 245 mm Orion f6.3 every bit as good as a C9.25. I think the scopes are pretty matched. with the Orion possibly having the edge, with smaller secondary larger mirror. The C9.25 more compact copes with wind better. higher focal length. Just interested why two similar perfoming scopes on planets. If your vx10 is f6.3. I would be surprised if the C9.25 outperformed it on planets. Even the C9.25 wont like wind. Though it will cope a bit better agreed. Even slightly windy nights dont often turn out to be the best, with either scope.

Most imagers i know get there best planetary shots on windless nights, that being true, the C9.25 losses its advantage to a degree.

Would make more sense i would have thought to go for apeture over the vx 10. C11 12" Newt ? but of course if you dont have at least a neq6. agreed this will not be possible. And even if you have, its maxing out the mount. Especially the 12" Im waiting for first light on a 300p on a neq6. I know wisdom says im pushing it agreed. but ive done some of my best stuff when ive pushed things. Looking at your equipment, and from what you said im guessing you just have the cg5, so im guessing you might be trying a shoot out, to see which one you want to keep.

Of course im guessing, i have no idea.

[philwright66]

Hi Neil, thanks for your advice. I bought the VX10L f6.3 in january. I do find it hard to handle. Imaging Jupiter with it the first time, the focuser was 8 feet in the air which was a bit difficult. Maybe i should get a better mount instead, and try to maximise usage of the 10" ? I have been looking at the NEQ6 AZ which would be ideal for the newt mounted in alt-az mode. I will be selling the 180 mak in any event. I would regard the 9.25 as more of a quick grab scope,and that is what is in my mind. the 10" is more of a big setting up ,cooling down instrument, which is fine when the sky is staying clear,but is a pain when the sky clouds over the minute i put the imaging cam into the focuser! i don't mind having two similar-performing scopes tbh,if the convenience factor is higher.

Thanks,Phil

[neil phillips]

Yeah i can see your thoughts more now. Grab and go as far as ease of setup, defiantely Phil. Grab and go as far as getting both scopes cooled, certainly not. if anything i belive you could get the Newt cooled faster. I will get to the mount questions in a min. I assume your Newt has a fan as standard, so thats sorted, another idea, one i use ( not ideal ) but the idea you could take to a new level if you wished. What i have been doing is i cut some cardboard, mounted a fan in the middle, i use cheap pound shop black tape ( its better because its rubbish ) it will not stick heavily, and will not mark your newt finish in the slightest, then i just tape it on and run both fans at the same time

http://www.flickr.co.../in/photostream

The overall time saved getting proper cooldown ( do not underestimate how long proper cooldown can actually take ) is dramatic to say the least, i can get my scope fully, and i mean fully. cooled in about a hour. before we was talking 2 or 3 hours.

You may think with a back facing fan the star test shows proper cooldown in about a hour hour and half. But ive found the images nearly always start to improve after the scope has been out for about 3 hours. Its something ive consistently seen over the years, no matter what the conditions, ( heated house winter ) summer time ect. Falling temps. whatever. Its been a consitent observation.

So of course the abillity to get cool fast, will have many many benefits. sometimes you will set up late, and now you can be up and running well cooled in about a hour. One thing you will have to think about though, is under heavy dew using a foward facing fan, could dew up the secondary, if the foward fan is run for too long. on those nights i tend to run it for between 20 to 30 mins max. with the back facing fan running all the time. i switch off when imaging though, by the time you have setup the lappy got your stuff in the garden. got the mount fired up camera running on the lappy. At least a hour will have passed.

Those extra 20 mins ( 30 if its a heated house in winter ) will make a big difference to images you will see on screen when you first get the planet or lunar on the lappy.

If you dont like the idea of messing with tape everytime. Get a Orion end cap. Fit the fan in with some good gaffa tape. Now you can just put the cap on and start it up. The only other thing you need to think about, is dust in your tube. As long as your tube is clean, you will be fine. Once you get to a certain stage of use. my mirrors are 7 years old, dust does not concern me. The little that could go down the tube doesnt notice in the slightest. But being new optics i would say just make sure your tube is fairly clean and you will be fine.

A SCT can also benefit from fans, and if you get a SCT, i would get a fan pronto. They have filters so no dust should enter As far as im aware. My 7" meade Mak had a fan with foam filter, dust wasnt a problem ever.

As far as the mount question goes its a tricky one actually Phil, because ive got great images with 245 mm Orion on vixen GP with wooden legs ( i also modified it with meade legs later ) im seriouse really i am.

But the point is, wind is a huge problem for planetary imaging, and even a neq6 will not rid your Newt, or even the sct of the wind problem. Though i absolutley agree a C/9.25 on a neq6 will cope with wind a lot better. So would be better for mild wind.

But any wind above a certain speed in my experiance dont bother, wait for a calmer night. I realize your saying a mount OR SCT but i wanted to explain incase you ever decide to get both.

Its hard to advise Phil. Most would certainly say get the neq6, as the Orion should be very good. And a good sturdy mount, is defiantley better. But considering the wind question i just discussed, under no wind i dont think the neq6 will actually make the images any better. Or at the very best only slightly. Deepsky is another matter maybe. but im not experianced to talk about that.

Its good tracking, no wind. good focus. Good collimation. Good seeing. And lastly good camera control that will make the biggest impact on your images i belive. This goes against the grain, and some may dissagree. But hey its a interesting world, and we all have our own experiances and beliefs. How well collimated is the vx ? how do the star tests look. Are the mirrors producing nice star tests either side of focus. A good set of 250mm Orion optics can really be quite special under excellent seeing.

[philwright66]

Hi again Neil,

Truly interesting ideas and advice. I will let you know how things turn out when i buy the 9.25. Maybe the neq6 in a few months for the autumn/winter nights.

Thanks again,phil

[Dunkster]

Just one other thing....if you're only interested in planetary imaging, the Edge HD model offers you nothing extra over the standard C9.25 sct, they are the same if the object is centred. The Edge HD adds additional glass to correct for coma and field curvature across the image, as these are normally a problem out towards the edges. I mention this because you could save yourself a bunch of cash

If you will use the scope for visual of DSOs also, then I'd recommend the Edge HD for the beautiful views you can get - I have the C11 Edge HD and I'm very happy with it

[philwright66]

my vx10 is actually very sharp with easily collimatable optics. the certified strehl is .996 with 1/10pv which cost me £200 extra so it should be good! the stars both sides of focus seem pretty identical to me with a quick look so i guess things are as stated.the one thing i do not like is the stock focuser. it has huge image shift which makes focusing a planet at long focal lengths very difficult. later this year i may upgrade the focuser to a baader steeltrack or a feather-touch.

cheers,phil

[neil phillips]

my vx10 is actually very sharp with easily collimatable optics. the certified strehl is .996 with 1/10pv which cost me £200 extra so it should be good! the stars both sides of focus seem pretty identical to me with a quick look so i guess things are as stated.the one thing i do not like is the stock focuser. it has huge image shift which makes focusing a planet at long focal lengths very difficult. later this year i may upgrade the focuser to a baader steeltrack or a feather-touch.

cheers,phil

Yeah i know the focusser shift, i just got a new one, hoping my older one was naff. but this also has image shift. its very strange as the focusers seem well made with good machined parts. The way to get around this is get the planet on screen, with the barlow you will be using, ( at least a 3 x for the vx, 2x for the SCT higher for good seeing )

find rough focus. Then take the camera out, now collimate with a laser. when you put the camera back in. you have just set collimation at the image shift region.

Of course if you change powers to a different barlow you will have to likely do this again. Such is the joy of image shift with a crayford focuser. getting a better one is a good idea. Though you might be talking drilling new holes on the scope.

Sounds like you will have a couple of excellent scopes for planetary Phil. hope to see you on the planetary imaging section when your sorted. Have you thought about a camera, webcams with the scopes you have is like a ferrari with so so wheels.

The cameras at zwo optical might be worth thinking about. A single shot colour should give you excellent results, and is a good way of getting your feet wet. with maybe a eye on RGB imaging if your interest grows. Although if your interested in hi res lunar. ( with your scopes i think its worth considering ) then the mono camera would be a better bet straight off, for the moon. And you could use RGB filters for the planets. i seriously wouldnt go the webcam way. Its cutting corners, and your scopes are better than that. Just my opinion.

[philwright66]

hi Dunkster, yes i know what you are saying. I am thinking along the lines of buying something where i don't get the 'what if i bought that instead' feeling. I guess i could save almost 1k if i bought the standard C9.25, but i have read so many reports of 'apo-like' performance from the EDGE HD versions that i would regret buying the non-HD version. I know that in the centre of the field the 2 types would be virtually identical if both are of similar quality,but for all-round observing especially low power views the new model would be much better.I used to have a wonderful WO flt110 apo so i know how nice the views are.

Cheers,Phil

[philwright66]

Hi again Neil,

The recollimation taking account of image shift is an interesting idea which i will try once i get a laser collimater.i have actually bought both the colour and mono versons of the ZWO ASI120 which i bought around december in anticipation of the great optics i am 'collecting' ! here is one of my VX10L first light Jupiter images,taken using an ASI120MC.

Thanks again,Phil

[seiko]

Hi Phil, Did you order from Telescope Service, if so how did the process go? as you say, it's a big saving! I'm considering a CPC1100 deluxe and the savings are huge! Thanks.

[ben_e71]

AM I searching for the correct company - Telescope Service Germany. As the company that comes up its prices once converted to pounds aren't cheaper for most scopes.

[seiko]

True but the scope I'm after is the same listed price so when the conversion kicks in I'd save £600+.

to be honest that's why I think the uk prices of this particular scope are 'fixed'.