Made a decision.... down the slippery slope

[Naemeth]

Okay, I haven't bought any green and black yet. But I've come to an important realization: I will save a lot of money if I go for TeleVue eyepieces straight away, no point in going for the middle ground really. Fortunately at the moment, at least, the scope (or at least, focuser) limits weight of an eyepiece to probably around 150g (most I'd be comfortable with putting on it), so this rules out: Ethos / Nagler / Delos / Panoptic (just, these may be okay) / Radian (difficult to get anyway).

Now, this is fortunate for me, all the high quality eyepieces at this level are around 50 degree, so I won't get the ultra-wide bug.

Here's my plan:

Save and get 3-6mm Nagler Zoom (Sell 4mm, Supplied MAs, TAL x2 Barlow) and keep the Vixen LV 7mm.

Get TeleVue Plössls, 15mm, 11mm, 20mm, 8mm, 26mm (then sell current 26mm), 32mm.

Relax, until I get a Sumerian Dob ~16" in quite a few years, then panic about ultra-wide eyepieces.

[John]

A top quality set will last a lifetime of observing and will work well with any scope you get in the future. There is a certain confidence you feel (or at least I do !) in putting a Tele Vue or an eyepiece of equivalent quality, into the focuser. It's the confidence that it will allow the scope and your eye to do the best they can under the seeing conditions

[Naemeth]

A top quality set will last a lifetime of observing and will work well with any scope you get in the future. There is a certain confidence you feel (or at least I do !) in putting a Tele Vue or an eyepiece of equivalent quality, into the focuser. It's the confidence that it will allow the scope and your eye to do the best they can under the seeing conditions

Is there a focal ratio they don't perform well at? I do worry a tad about sub F/4 (for a huge dob, I don't really want a step ladder!)

[John]

Is there a focal ratio they don't perform well at? I do worry a tad about sub F/4 (for a huge dob, I don't really want a step ladder!)

Tele Vue eyepieces are designed and tested to be sharp across the field of view down to F/4. I can't think of a brand that is more likely to perform well in very fast scopes, at least not one thats available to mere mortals !

[Doug]

Hi Jonathan

There is another way to go buy a larger scope

Radian eyepieces are a nice eyepiece and worth having you can get then from Telescope House at the moment

I have a 14mm and it was very shape and has good contrast I was looking at Saturn at the time

let us know what you decide

clear skies

[Stargazer_00]

I think it's un wise to think you won't get bitten by the ultra wide bug. especially as prices of competitor eyepieces fall. Many people say that these other premium brands compete and sometimes even match tv quality.

I had this same choice recently and I went for a full set of exsc. I could've gotten two maybe even three naglers second hand sure but I decided I was unlikely to get a scope faster than f4.5 so the ex sc would likely be fine and rather than invest in eyepieces that were individually corrected for coma I would get a good coma corrector for use with all. Spread Across all the range the corrector would make the net price for cona corrected eyepieces cheaper.

I have no intention of buying tv eyepieces until the cheaper alternatives show abberations i can't live with. I expect the ex sc range I just bought should last well and be good quality. All The reviews indicate this.

[Stargazer_00]

Also you are listing eyepiece brands that tv produce smoky based on the fact that tv produce them rather than for what each range individually brings. They Each have a function. A job. They are merely tools. Good ones but tools nonetheless. You need to decided what job you want them to do first and but for that. You don't buy the hammer first and only then look for a nail it's designed to hit.

[foundaplanet]

I can vouch for TV plossls in a 4.8 (also have a barlow), they are pin sharp edge to edge and they have given me some amazing views. It is on those odd nights of good seeing that I really notice the class of them. I have looked through a couple of nags and an ethos and although the fov's are thrilling the image quality is not better. I would go as far as saying that I don't think they were quite as sharp, certainly the green gas of M42 was not as intense or quite as crisp for me. I have little knowledge of ep's and less experience in using them but I bet there is not a better plossl on the market and if they were to stop making them it would be a BGO crisis all over again. They are excellent on colours with stars and the background sky is very black. If I was to buy them again though I would not get the 8mm, it is a tad awkward on my eye and at this kind of focal length I much prefer my circle t ortho's.

I would really like 2/3 nags though all the same but until I feel that the weather is taking a more friendly approach to our hobby they have dropped well down the list of priorities.

[Stargazer_00]

Editing via phone is hard hence multi post:

Final Point. Don't sell the tal 2x Barlow!

[Stargazer_00]

All that said i am thinking about a 10mm tv plossl for when I want the best views possible of globs in my dob.

[Stargazer_00]

I've more to say if that's possible.

I do feel that, if your aren't upgrading your scope, a set of tv plossls is a great choice for you and your strategy for focal lengths looked sound

[alan potts]

There is nothing wrong with Televue Plossl eyepieces but I would sort out your focuser first.

You are always going to be wondering what the Delos, Ethos and Naglers are like. If for whatever reason you can't do this the Nagler T6 range are as light as any, they weigh less than short Radians, 3mm, 4mm, 5mm and 6mm.. The shorter T6 are a bit heavier but 13mm 11mm and 9mm I would have thought would be fine.

Alan

[Moonshane]

the best quality eyepieces don't correct coma, they just don't have the faults, displayed by cheaper brands, in a fast scope. in fact the coma is more apparent with better eyepieces as it is masked by the faults of the poorer eyepieces.

a coma corrector gives the best of both worlds with good eyepieces as it corrects the coma (who'd have thought it?? ) and you then have a coma and 'fault free' view.

for your scope and at f5 though I completely agree with your choices other than to say that the 24mm and 19mm Panoptics would be superb also. however, in your shoes, I'd be buying TVPs and if you can the 'Plossl on Steroids) that is the Nagler 6-3mm zoom. you could as suggested buy a larger scope but in reality as John said, a good set of eyepieces like this will 'travel' to any scope. Televue are not the only option but for the specific eyepiece types you have mentioned, there's not many others at the same quality.

if you buy used, you'll never lose money on them either.

[MadAlbert]

Perhaps a slight rethink?

2 x TV Plossl = 8" dob newt (sh?) = good compromise (?)

[RikM]

TV plossls offer a very nice affordable introduction into the world of premium eyepieces (I have the older 13, 21 and 40mm). This is pretty much the pinnacle of optical quality, after that the view just gets wider and more comfortable.

[Dunkster]

You're going to need a bigger scope

Then you need to try Panoptics, Naglers, Ethoses.... it's a very slippery slope, but you owe it to yourself to experience for yourself, it really is eye opening

Some of the wides are pretty light, Nagler T6 spring to mind. I'd be surprised if they were too much for your 130...

[russ.will]

Perhaps a slight rethink?

2 x TV Plossl = 8" dob newt (sh?) = good compromise (?)

I'm wondering why more people aren'y saying this?

I mean, the Heritage 130 might be a decent little scope, but it ain't going to show half the DSO fuzzies that a 200p will, no matter what EP you drop in it.

Naemeth; My advise is stop spending small amounts on an EP here or there, let the cash build up and buy a Skyliner 200p. At the moment, it's a bit like trying to buy Pirelli P-Zeros for a Ferrari you haven't got and aren't sure whether you'll get. Once you have it, or if it turns out you wanted a Range Rover anyway, then you will be in far better place to judge what tyres EPs will do the job for you.

Yes the TV Plossls will be great in virtually any scope, but first, get the scope!

Russell

[username]

I would have to agree with the scope first crowd. I've made some eyepiece purchases to give some options at high power and I'm luck that I have a slow scope (so everything works ok). However all my astro funds are going towards a bigger better scope now.

What you see will ultimately always be limited by your telescope aperture and quality of primary finish/objective finish/telescope design (and the weather ). Not saying that decent eyepieces aren't worth it though.

[Naemeth]

Thanks everyone, there have been a lot of replies and questions so I will take my time to answer them all.

//

Bigger Scope

Right now, I'm not in the market of an upgrade in my scope and it's not because of cost, it's mainly for transport issues. At the moment, anywhere I go is on foot, usually to my back garden, where an 8" dob is not a problem. However, I'm moving in a few months, and may move somewhere where I'll be up and down stairs in a flat with the scope, this makes it harder to transport an 8" dob, and I don't think I'd be able to take it on foot any significant distance (which I may need to). My current scope once I've sorted the transportation aspect (bag will be very impact resistant to avoid knocks etc.) will be all ready in this regard. Once I know my living situation exactly, and probably once I have a car, I'll be able to upgrade the scope, but this is only when that's happened.

Focuser

The main problem that I can't see any way around is the focuser, I can't see any way to upgrade it without getting a new tube because the focuser itself is attached via plastic to the tube, and this is the bit I worry about, it's not very thick or sturdy. To make it any more stable would probably require a whole re-design. Photo of the problem:

Ultra-Wide

I agree it's naïve to think I won't get caught in the ultra-wide bug, and I most certainly will, but not at this stage (hopefully). I'd rather get the best quality I could that would last me a long time - the future big dob I'm looking at will probably be F/4 (easier to transport at that size than F/5! When I've got a car of course ).

Coma

Hopefully in the TV Plössls this won't be too bad (32mm will only really get used when I go to dark sites, which is why I'm getting it last) as the FOV is smaller than an ultra wide, but I do plan on getting a Paracorr before I go into ultra-wides.

Barlow

Personally I don't see the need in a barlow in my current line-up or in my future line-up. It's not without faults - some vignetting on longer focal length eyepieces, huge increase in eye relief for long focal length eyepieces (although all barlows have this). In my current line-up, I only really use it for fun, to see what the Moon looks like at 325x, I don't really use it enough to warrant it, and it would do better with someone else.

T6 Naglers

I must admit - I hadn't consider the T6 Naglers, I think I'll stick with the Plössls for now though, but they are certainly an option.

//

Weird situation, I know. Any eyepiece of high quality I buy will be able to go in any scope I use and I know I'll be getting the best out of it, I'll be buying 2nd hand so I shouldn't lose any money on them, and at least when I do upgrade I won't need to think about new eyepieces (although, I'll probably want ultra-wides by that point.

[Stargazer_00]

This Might sound stupid I don't know but what about getting a 150pds ota and making a small light weight dob base yourself. It'd be far smaller than the 1200mm focal length 150p dob. And Have a 2" dual speed focuser. And A nice aperture increase to boot. Could handle any eyepieces you wanted as well

I think site members could even make you a base of you ask the right people/person

[Stargazer_00]

Explorer 150p otas are about 100 quid second hand. Base is materials if you do it yourself. The normal crayford focuser type.

[ronin]

Whatever makes you think buying TV's will save money as you won't need others?

I have had the set of TV plossl's for some time.

Somewhere along the line I bought the set of WO SWANS.

Then I bought the set of BST Explorers.

Throw in another set of plossl's for public evenings, and 4 or 5 Antares W70's.

What happens is you buy another set of something for when you don't want to use the TV's at things like star parties and public nights, or for people that cannot keep their finger prints off TV glass or tend to drop things.

[Stargazer_00]

That's the one reason I've got for thinking I might finish off my bst set. for going to star parties or for when family want a go.

Plus I kind of just wanted to finish that set. .. hard to justify now though. Only Need 8 12 15

[Naemeth]

Whatever makes you think buying TV's will save money as you won't need others?

I have had the set of TV plossl's for some time.

Somewhere along the line I bought the set of WO SWANS.

Then I bought the set of BST Explorers.

Throw in another set of plossl's for public evenings, and 4 or 5 Antares W70's.

What happens is you buy another set of something for when you don't want to use the TV's at things like star parties and public nights, or for people that cannot keep their finger prints off TV glass or tend to drop things.

Perhaps when I have a larger scope that might be a consideration too, thanks Ronin

[Moonshane]

maybe I'm mad but I use the same eyepieces at star parties as I do at home as I don't have any others. OK I don't use my eyepieces at school for the reasons above but I like everyone to experience what I am seeing rather than " Oh just wait a minute while I put a cheapo eyepiece in for you to look through". then again it did irritate me once when someone tested where the eyepiece was by touching the eye lens of my 13mm Ethos. Thankfully it was cold and he had a dry finger tip (or missed).