Oh my my Celestron 15x70 gamble really didnt pay off - at all

[Astro_noob]

Oops, despite some very helpful assistance and warning I decided to go ahead and buy the 15x70s from a wel known sites warehouse in *Good* condition for £55 thinking - wow what a bargain. They arrived very promptly and The box was freakin huge! I opened them and was astonished by the size and weight of these things - absolutely massive and for anyone who says they can hand hold these things I say you are either popeye or kidding yourself. I did have a look through them in the dark and they are so damn good I can can see extra copies of stars - 2 for the price of one. What a bargain. Oh wait reviewing past comments they may be out of collimation - I was warned!

I managed to prize open the access to the screws and clearly someone had tried this before as there was a telltale sign of screwdrived marks on the surface of the metal. To make matters worse the objectives have dust on the inside!

I really hope I can get a refund on these binoculars as I am really dissapointed. They might be a bargain but they are also faulty!

Consequently I like the apperture and magnification so I may consider a similar pair from another manufacturer. Can anyone tell me if the Nikon 12x50 action EX binoculars will be almost as bright as the celestron due to significantly better coatings?

[spaceboy]

You will find for all intense purposes these are basically the same bins but with a different name on them http://www.rothervalleyoptics.co.uk/revelation-15x70-binocular-special-offer_d4647.html

You should be covered under the distance selling act so a refund shouldn't be an issue but you will most likely be out of pocket for return postage.

[Catweazel]

Oh dear, sorry to hear about your bins! I have them, and have to use a tripod with them, but am very happy with the views I get; those who say that they hand hold them are probably in a reclined chair or laying down . As spaceboy says, you should get a refund (minus postage). It may be worth checking with Rother Valley Optics if they check the collimation on their bins prior to dispatch, as this will save you problems on receipt.

[andrew63]

I must admit i prefer 10x50 - certainly for handheld use. Hope you can sort it out though.

andrew

[Astro_noob]

• Lessons learned I guess! I now know what 70mm objectives and 15X magnification offer but how does a better but smaller objective compare i.e. a 50mm objective with really good coatings? Physics would suggest the larger light capturing surface will provide for a brighter image but poor or non existing coatings will mean a lot of the light is reflected prior to reaching the eye!
  

[Chris]

I've owned a few pairs of bins now, some of them like my Opticron Aspheric 8x40's and Helios Stellar 20x80 are of good quality and bring a smile to you face just holding them net alone using them:D on the other hand I did first of all try a cheap 25 quid 10x50 which where basically sent broken as mentioned, the barrel on one side was cross threaded so they gave double images like what you've been experiencing. I screwed this on straight but the quality of the of optics and the build quality were so poor that they were pretty much unusable so I sent them back.

I would now only buy good quality bins, its so worth it! even if you're lucky and get a good cheap pair they often have BK7 prisms which block a fair amount of light (look down the exit pupil and you will see a diamond shape with BK7) BK4 on the other hand are un-obsructed so give brighter views.

If weight is an issue I can recommend my Opticron Aspheric 8x40's they are ace! Straphspey and Helios sell some good quality bins for the money as well if you want to check them out.

hth

Chris

[andrew63]

I have a pair of opticron 10x50s they give really nice views - bright and contrasty. I think binoculars are a bit like eyepieces - with a good pair you notice the difference.

andrew

[Damo636]

I would now only buy good quality bins, its so worth it! even if you're lucky and get a good cheap pair they often have BK7 prisms which block a fair amount of light (look down the exit pupil and you will see a diamond shape with BK7) BK4 on the other hand are un-obsructed so give brighter views.

hth

Chris

Hmmm, might be an idea to have a read here...

http://binocularsky.com/binoc_minefield.php

[Parus major]

I remember last March I think it was when a regarded seller was doing Celestrons for about £20 and i told people not to bother and the flack I got was huge.

I'm a keen birdwatcher and in the same way as we tell folk on here not to buy telescopes by Seben and Nat Geo birdwatchers know that unless they cost £95+ they are pointless and will be out of collimation within six months and six days if they're sub £50.

Get a refund, if you want binoculars then get a decent pair that you've tried in a shop, if they don't hold up to much abuse then the display model will be beyond use.

[BinocularSky]

Oops, despite some very helpful assistance and warning I decided to go ahead and buy the 15x70s from a wel known sites warehouse in *Good* condition for £55 thinking - wow what a bargain.

I think we should be told who this retailer is (either here or in the supplier reviews section) -- we don't want anyone else wasting time on somehting that is advertised as "good condition" when it clearly isn't.

[stuck_record]

Re the binocular: On one hand, it is remarkable that a manufacturer can knock out a binocular for the same cost as a half-way decent eyepiece. On the other hand, if you are getting two eyepieces, two objective lenses, two prism assemblies, two different focus mechanisms and various bits of associated tubing and housings for the same cost as a half-way decent eyepiece, exactly what quality -- and what quality control -- is it reasonable to expect?

[/stuck_record]

Consequently I like the apperture and magnification so I may consider a similar pair from another manufacturer. Can anyone tell me if the Nikon 12x50 action EX binoculars will be almost as bright as the celestron due to significantly better coatings?

The Nikon will be almost as bright (about half a magnitude difference), mostly because it is not as much smaller than you may think. The Nikon is actually a 12.2x49 (see here), whilst the cheap Chinese things marked as 15x70 are actually around 15x62 (see here), i.e. they only let through about 60% -- about half a magnitude -- more light! Just as important, though, is the Nikon is much better made, both optically and mechanically, than the cheap 15x70, and will be more of a pleasure to use.

The cheap 15x70s do serve one important purpose, though: they offer a perfect example of why the well-meant advice to beginners that infests internet forums, magazines, etc that "If you get BaK4 prisms and FMC (fully multicoated) you can't go far wrong" is just plain wrong. Yesterday, for another purpose, I made a list of twenty one important things that "BaK4 & FMC" tells you exactly nothing about.

[fwm891]

http://binocularsky.com/binoc_eval.php This has got to be the best 'read' for anyone buying bins - especially their first pair - helped me no end... Going for a pair of B&S Savannah's once FLO get them back in stock.

[Moonshane]

I am not a fan of bins at all but if I were to buy a pair I think they would be 7x50 or 8x40. You can buy a used 6" newtonian or small achro for that sort of money and with a little work can make a dob base for it at about £100 total. The images of everything except views over 3 degrees will be far superior although I accept the convenience of binoculars.

[andrew63]

I am not a fan of bins at all but if I were to buy a pair I think they would be 7x50 or 8x40. You can buy a used 6" newtonian or small achro for that sort of money and with a little work can make a dob base for it at about £100 total. The images of everything except views over 3 degrees will be far superior although I accept the convenience of binoculars.

I understand that not everybody likes them - but perhaps you are being a bit harsh - they can provide some stunning vistas - especially a good pair. They are a great addition to your armoury.

andrew

[Moonshane]

I am sure you are right Andrew, they are certainly enjoyed greatly by many but I just thought I'd put a slightly different perspective on the discussion in case the OP had not considered a used scope and a new scope was considered out of budget.

[Damo636]

I am not a fan of bins at all but if I were to buy a pair I think they would be 7x50 or 8x40. You can buy a used 6" newtonian or small achro for that sort of money and with a little work can make a dob base for it at about £100 total. The images of everything except views over 3 degrees will be far superior although I accept the convenience of binoculars.

I have just 10 minutes ago parted company with the price of an 8" dob on a new 15x70 binocular!

I only recently bought my first half decent 10x50 and loved the things, so much so they convinced me to part with my 31 Nagler to fund the new bins :-)

[Moonshane]

a good demonstration that there's room for everyone in this excellent hobby of ours!

[BinocularSky]

I have just 10 minutes ago parted company with the price of an 8" dob on a new 15x70 binocular!

I only recently bought my first half decent 10x50 and loved the things, so much so they convinced me to part with my 31 Nagler to fund the new bins :-)

Darn, you should have said! I fancy one of those 31mm Naglers for my Dob, and I have this Kunming BA1 15x70 that I'm keen to get rid of once I've finished using it for tests, etc. (the one in the 2nd link in my previous post). Given that it's got two eyepieces, two obj....(etc), I'm sure you'd have considered it a bargain!

[Damo636]

[Lenny147]

Join the club, got the t shirt Soon changed to 10x50

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Chris]

Hmmm, might be an idea to have a read here...

http://binocularsky....c_minefield.php

Thanks for the eye opener, so I guess the only way to know for sure if a pair of binoculars are any good or not is by there reputation and reviews, and the specs on bins are often misleading and almost meaningless. Its a shame theres no easy way of telling:(

[cantab]

Like a lot of other things really. The specs on the box won't tell you what a car is actually like to drive, they often won't really tell you how good the picture is on a TV, and they certainly won't tell you whether a ready-made sandwich actually tastes good or not.

[Chris]

Hi cantab, all I know is if I bought a car with a 1247cc engine I would expect it do have a 1247cc engine and not a 998cc engine. The stopping down aperture tactics highlighted in the article are particularly shocking don't you think?! net alone the use of under sized prisms.

[fwm891]

Thanks for the eye opener, so I guess the only way to know for sure if a pair of binoculars are any good or not is by there reputation and reviews, and the specs on bins are often misleading and almost meaningless. Its a shame theres no easy way of telling:(

Best way is to go to a reputable seller and try them out (after reading the above so you know what to look 4)......

[cantab]

The stopping down aperture tactics highlighted in the article are particularly shocking don't you think?!

I guess I don't find it shocking purely because I've been aware of it for some time. I was slightly irked when I checked both my pairs of bins and found they were stopped down by about 8mm each, but what really matters is whether I'm happy with the views. Not having looked through anything that performs better at the same price, I have to say yes. (Mind you, I didn't and probably wouldn't have bought the 15x70s at full price, I mostly paid in clubcard vouchers, and I thankfully have a pair in collimation!)

[BinocularSky]

Thanks for the eye opener, so I guess the only way to know for sure if a pair of binoculars are any good or not is by there reputation and reviews

Depends on the reviews. I would give a lot more weight to a review in (say) an astronomy magazine or a birding forum than I would to one on (say) Amazon.