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Damo636

M57 Central Star

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Im going to have a try and have got a 16 inch lightbridge since last year so stand more of a chance. I have quite bad light pollution though so its going to be a hard challenge, and 276x is as high as I can go and thats with a Plossl so Im sure Ill be chasing it across the sky with only a limited field of view.

Im at kielder in November so this will be one of my targets but I have a feeling I may have lost it too close to the horizon by then - unless its an early evening / early morning target but its the best dark skies Im going to get.

So, has anyone seen it this summer, and has anyone gone better than 12inch ?

Cheers

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Hmmm... Easily seen with my 8"/F4 Newt... with 10s of Watec (video cam) internal stacking.

I now have in some sense a 16 - 20" Dob? Well, once every 10 seconds or so? [joking] :D

But (hopefully) a semi-serious point. I doubt I will ever see this with my scope. But I applaud these efforts to "quantify the possible"! Even been prompted to produce my own "inkjet documentation". No Steve O'Meara, but sometimes I even actually DO make the comparison: Video versus Visual (after)! Never given to taking notes, with worsening memory, at least I can scribble randomly on the inverted printouts... ;)

Edited by Macavity

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Just checked and Vega will be at 38 degrees above the horizon at 8pm at the start of november so all being well I'll get this from the dark skies of kielder , weather permitting !

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Give it a shot, but I reckon 38 degrees isn't high enough. The central star really needs a steady atmosphere so when it's near overhead is best. I saw it two of three times last summer in the 18", but only when it was virtually over head. My notes indicate that I was at 420x.

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Im sure James O'meera says its an easy naked eye object ;-)

Edited by Astroscot2
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Im sure James O'meera says its an easy naked eye object ;-)

:D Yes, the hyperbaric oxygen chamber is next on my list.

Or, failing that, a large sack of carrots?

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Give it a shot, but I reckon 38 degrees isn't high enough. The central star really needs a steady atmosphere so when it's near overhead is best. I saw it two of three times last summer in the 18", but only when it was virtually over head. My notes indicate that I was at 420x.

Thanks Umadog, Ill wind Stellarium back a bit to see what height it will be at 1hr after sunset, it should be higher but not overhead. And 420x is higher than Ive got at the moment but I might get it at 276x but then again seeing might not allow much higher anyway. ....... sounds like a good challenge though !

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Had a bash at this last weekend from the llyn peninsular with my larger scope.

The seeing was good and steady, Lyra was at a reasonable altitude. The sky perhaps wasn't as dark as it could be, but I've read seeing is more important than darkness for this particular object.

At 190x the ring was a glorious blue colour, and I thought I was catching glimpses of it. But upon upping the power to 380x it proved unfounded. I observed M57 for about 1/2 hr at this power with no joy. Think I need more power than this to bag this little blighter.

This is no gimme even with a 20" scope it would seem. A revisit with more juice is needed.

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Still on my to do list Steve...maybe at Dobfest2?

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The central star of M57  is high on my to-do list when I visit Olly for some 20" Dob piloting this summer. Fingers crossed/

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The central star of M57  is high on my to-do list when I visit Olly for some 20" Dob piloting this summer. Fingers crossed/

Good luck Michael. I believe Olly's Dob is at altitude, that should help. You'll need some high power though.

I was close to sea level. Next time I try I shall be in the welsh mountains.

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Good luck Michael. I believe Olly's Dob is at altitude, that should help. You'll need some high power though.

I was close to sea level. Next time I try I shall be in the welsh mountains.

I am going to bring my entire kit (long live the Espace, which can carry ALL my kit, the camping gear, and the missus' shoes ;)), so magnification will not be a problem (XW7 plus TeleXtender/PowerMate). As I spotted a mag 13.5 galaxy with the C8 before, and supernovae and quasars down to mag 13.9, I have high hopes for this target. I also want to use the big dob to find some much fainter galaxies than the ones within reach of my trusty C8.

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I was fortunate a few weeks back to view the central star. However it was through a friends 24" dob at very high power from a good dark site. I think it was around 600x. We were actually just seeing the inner nebulosity in the FOV. It is supposed to be between mag 14 & mag 16 but also obscured by that nebulosity probably dimmer.So good luck to those with smaller apertures hoping to see it. 

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I expect those imagers could get it with 10 seconds of exposure or even with one of those video cameras!

I will give it a go this year and that IC galaxy with my fresh 16 inch mirrors.

Mark

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Good luck Mark, it has been done many times with a scope that size, but a good night is called for.

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it's probably one of those perfect optics, collimation, seeing, darkness and eye quality things.

I agree with Shane. 

In http://www.amazon.co.uk/Illustrated-Guide-Astronomical-Wonders-Observer/dp/0596526857 reference to NGC7635 P153 it writes " We tried in many sessions at dark sky sites over several years to log the bubble nebula, with scopes ranging from 10" to 17.5" at various magnifications, and with or with out filters. We never saw the faintest hint of nebulkosity, despite knowing exactly where to look. We finally succeeded one very clear night in autumn 2006, using a friends 17.5" telescope from, oddly enough, one of our suburban observing sites."

I will never forget M42 on night from my LP back garden when I could clearly see pink in the nebula and split all the trapezium stars with uncanny ease. I was also able to barlow a nagler 3-6 zoom in my 200P and easily see the darker inner rings of Saturn which at the time didn't realize how significant that was. My point being is when the conditions are perfect the "Highest Practical Power (Potential)" of a telescope becomes a reality. I will forever kick myself for not just jumping in to the car that night and heading out to dark skies as I think that would have been a real eye opening moment.

I'm sure if the skies were ever so good again I would be spinning the scope around all over the place to see if such objects like M57's centre star can be seen. That is once I arrived under dark skies after being stopped by the police for speeding there :grin:

EDIT: Hang on how old is this thread. I really must get in the hang of checking the dates before I post :blink:  

Edited by spaceboy

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right fellow SGLer's...'tis the season for this. I know this is an old thread but with a lot of new members on here it makes an interesting read for those hunting for M57. I'm off to Elan in a couple of weeks and yet again this will be one of the targets for that weekend...Happy hunting!

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I had M57 looking great at 130x with a tint of blue-green at the Skellig Star Party on Friday night, and was keeping the mag reasonable for sharing the EP with anyone who wanted to take a wee peek. I had literally got my Powermate out to up the mag for a shot at the central star and whoa! Where did it go? Cloud had rolled in! Never got to push for it that night, but will soon ;) No matter, nice to have others look through the scope there was a very friendly atmosphere.

Really dark skies rule - just itching to go again :)

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I was pretty sure that I was getting glimpses of M57's central star a few nights back at high magnification. I was using a Pentax XW (454x) with my 12" dob. These glimpses were fleeting though - I could not "hold" the star for more than a second or so.

By comparison M27's central star seems quite easy - thats mag 13.5 apparently !

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