green laser safety with high-alt aircraft?

[canadave]

This may be a very naive newbie question, but I'm curious. I live in a rural area that has no air traffic EXCEPT that we are directly under one of the air corridors to Europe So every night, there is a procession of planes at cruising altitude flying overhead.

If I were to shoot a green laser into the sky to point out a constellation for friends gathered around, would that represent any hazard to those high-altitude cruising aircraft?

[Stargazer Jack]

Interesting question and would like to know the answer as well.

[Grunthos]

No risk to high altitude aircraft

Sent from my GT-I9100

[Stargazer Jack]

That's good, thanks.

[iwatkins]

None at all.

High power lasers you can buy have a relatively high divergence rate and has a lot of atmosphere to pass through to reach airliners. And pilots in airliners at 25k+ feet wouldn't even be able to look straight down anyway.

Now if a helicopter came over at a couple of hundred feet, that would be different. You could seriously distract them/dazzle them when they are flying night adapted. Or military could have their NVGs maxed out or sensors saturated.

Rumour is an Army Apache on a training mission was targeted by some yobs in a sink estate near Norwich a month or so ago. The pilot landed in the field behind the house, the gunner got out, went and punched this lout in the face, climbed back in and flew off. Unconfirmed, but probably never will be.

But if you are flying low level, on full NVGS or other sensitive instrument, and got blinded by someone, I think I would be angry too.

Ian

[Probablynot]

No risk to high altitude aircraft

I'd not be so certain. OK, I did see an ad for a green laser that said it was effective to 12,000 feet, and by the time planes from Heathrow/Gatwick get to the west coast they're probably flying at twice that altitude. But what about planes from Manchester? Cardiff?

I was going to say 'Just be careful'. But actually, be more than careful. Flinging a laser about in the sky is a bit like flinging a sharp knife into a bath full of babies ...

[Grunthos]

I'd not be so certain.

Oh (dabbling as a private pilot) I'm pretty certain .

"No risk to high altitude aircraft"

[canadave]

Thanks everyone for the replies.

I'd not be so certain. OK, I did see an ad for a green laser that said it was effective to 12,000 feet, and by the time planes from Heathrow/Gatwick get to the west coast they're probably flying at twice that altitude. But what about planes from Manchester? Cardiff?

I was going to say 'Just be careful'. But actually, be more than careful. Flinging a laser about in the sky is a bit like flinging a sharp knife into a bath full of babies ...

I'm actually in Nova Scotia, Canada, in a very rural area, and the only planes, helicopters, or aliens that I've ever seen at night over the past 5 years have been high overhead at 35,000 feet. We're on the "jet highway to Europe" for all planes coming from the United States.

That being said, obviously I will exercise all due caution and restraint in the use of any laser pointer I eventually acquire

[cosmological]

Aircraft usually fly at between 30,000 and under 40,000 feet including those from Heathrow by the time the get over here. Planes from Manchester are usually under 10,000 feet by the time they get here and even lower going to Manchester.

[brantuk]

People have been arrested and charged for jeopardising aircraft by shining lasers into cockpits. If you don't want a swat team surrounding your house in the middle of the night be very careful how you use your laser

[klytus]

i just use the rule that if i can't see or hear aircraft its safe to do so and at night round me there's not hardly any air traffic apart from the proverbial police helicopter chasing some yobs in my chav town sorry to say

[ronin]

Does Canada have similar restrictions as the US has on power out put ?

Assuming they do, 5mW max then for an aircraft at normal cruising height I would doubt that you would manage to get a noticable beam up to one of them. Actually doubt that even if the pilot's opened a hatch in the floor and looked directly at you they would see anything.

Flights I have made to Canada always seem to be up at the 50,000 ft mark. Suppose on the return they could be lower to pick up the jet stream.

[decomo50]

Green lazers are an amazing tool when doing outreach events - which i have been involved with here in ireland. The over use of laser pens at star parties can be annoying or worse, in the hands of the intellectually challanged - if any of you admin people are reading this could i suggest we as a group of mostly harmless astronomers come together and create a declaration on the safe and proper use of lasers....in other words, lets self regulate before governments legislate

Declan

[laser_jock99]

Your typical 5mW laser pointer will do no harm at 30 feet never mind 30,000 feet. Over the years i've read so much **** over this subject it's almost untrue!

[Kit-Fox]

I dont know if anyone else has considered this, but you may want to look up any established air corridors for military traffic and small light places (which can be dazzled by some lasers if they are flying at low altitude)

Also police & rescue helis arent always required to file flight plans (or the plans might be restricted access at times) so keep an ear out for them, because if they so much as see the hint of a laser beam (even if they arent blinded by it) they will attempt to bring the full force of the law down on you these days :)

Which is a shame as lasers can be used in public quite safely with just a small amount of forethought & planning

[MrTreyLynch]

I have a 100 mW green laser. Has a key to operate system just in case one of my idiot friends grabs it. Never see planes in my area though as I am a hundred miles plus from any large town let alone a city lol

[Sputnic]

None at all.

High power lasers you can buy have a relatively high divergence rate and has a lot of atmosphere to pass through to reach airliners. And pilots in airliners at 25k+ feet wouldn't even be able to look straight down anyway.

Now if a helicopter came over at a couple of hundred feet, that would be different. You could seriously distract them/dazzle them when they are flying night adapted. Or military could have their NVGs maxed out or sensors saturated.

Rumour is an Army Apache on a training mission was targeted by some yobs in a sink estate near Norwich a month or so ago. The pilot landed in the field behind the house, the gunner got out, went and punched this lout in the face, climbed back in and flew off. Unconfirmed, but probably never will be.

But if you are flying low level, on full NVGS or other sensitive instrument, and got blinded by someone, I think I would be angry too.

Ian

blumming hell that would really sting!

I remember a friend of mine flashing his maglite into my CWS when i was on excersice and needless to say, the said maglite was never found again! lol

[symesie04]

None at all.

Rumour is an Army Apache on a training mission was targeted by some yobs in a sink estate near Norwich a month or so ago. The pilot landed in the field behind the house, the gunner got out, went and punched this lout in the face, climbed back in and flew off. Unconfirmed, but probably never will be.

Ian

How incredibly irresponsible of the Apache crew! They really should of let loose a salvo of hellfires instead and done everyone a favour

[starnut]

Have a look here to see what hight they are flying are (lefthand click on plane)

Plane Finder ? Flight Radar | Aircraft Tracker | Live Flight Tracking

[Alma]

I have a 100 mW green laser. Has a key to operate system just in case one of my idiot friends grabs it. Never see planes in my area though as I am a hundred miles plus from any large town let alone a city lol

You should point out since this is a newbie thread that to use a laser pointer outdoors in the U.S. more powerful than 5mw you're required by law to notify the FAA at least 30 days in advance of each and every use by completing a 2 page form detailing both the planned usage and the technical spec of the device itself, otherwise you're violating Federal law.

For our UK newbies, there is no law here which limits the power of lasers you can point at the sky, however it's a criminal offence to point any laser at an aircraft regardless of the power and regardless of whether the incident was intentional or accidental, so caution is advised.