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Heliocentric

Odd Moon Phenomenon...tell me what it is!

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The thing is, if you watch the video carefully, you'll see 5 to 7 objects that seem to appear from behind the (Moon) horizon, then pass in front of the Moon untill they dissappear in the reflecting light, as if they were in close orbit.

Is this really compatible with occultation?

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Yeah noticed that (coming over the surface) on others as well, very strange. I took a pic a couple of years ago with an anomily which i noticed when zoomed in. I sent a copy to a local moon expert and he was baffled by it, the only thing he could suggest was a possible meteor impact. If I can find the original, I'll post it and see if anyone on here can i.d. it

David

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My bet is geosynchronous satellites -- if we had exact time and location of observer, we could check.

Not meteor impacts: the mean duration of "glow" from these is around 30ms and those spots that are seen against the light of the Moon are travelling much (i.e several orders of magnitude) slower than even the slowest meteors.

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Well the moon is moving and the 'objects' are not, it could just be dirty optics. They only come into vision when the bright light of the moon illuminates them and they only come into vision as the moon moves behind it. I'm fairly sure the only thing moving in that video is the moon. It could even be moisture with the light refracting off of it.

I recommend some baader optical wonder fluid.

Edited by Pibbles

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My bet is geosynchronous satellites -- if we had exact time and location of observer, we could check.

The date is the 9th of July 2011, I don't have the exact hour.Late evening, since it's summer?

The Youtube poster is Dutch, apparently from the Eindhoven area, let's go with that.

We're looking for five satellites close together, and the poster said there was another two he didn't film, so possibly seven.

That should narrow down the search somewhat.

Edited by Heliocentric

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OK, so far its not a geostationary -- altitude and azimuth don't fit (about 10* too low).

(BTW, the vid has #6&7 on it.)

Will see what else I can find and edit this ....

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Apparantly the Russians have left some lunar orbit "space junk" behind from earlier missions although it is thought that most of it has crashed onto the moon by now. NASA's policy was to crash all un-manned probs onto the moon at the end of the expedition, there are a few (three?) lunar missions at present so maybe these are what are being seen? List of current and future lunar missions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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Apparantly the Russians have left some lunar orbit "space junk" behind from earlier missions although it is thought that most of it has crashed onto the moon by now. NASA's policy was to crash all un-manned probs onto the moon at the end of the expedition, there are a few (three?) lunar missions at present so maybe these are what are being seen? List of current and future lunar missions - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lol just read that back they would hardly crash manned probes would they :D

Edited by philhas

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Lol just read that back they would hardly crash manned probes would they :D

No.

Don't forget we're talking 5 to 7 objects here, and if you think about it, they have to be pretty large if they're close to the Moon.

Another strange thing, even though it looks like they're in close orbit, how could it be? Correct me if I'm wrong, but any orbiting object have to spend half the time above the equator and half the time below - ie they have to orbit the center of the object pulling them in.

ALL of those objects are coming in at an angle that will not take them around the center of the Moon.

I still think some type of meteor cluster is the most likely option, even if the speed is all wrong.

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Yes, very interesting actually. The Moon is an odd lump of rock!

I still think that if these objects were in orbit around the Moon, even briefly, at least some of the thousands of telescopes pointed at the Moon daily would have picked them out, no?

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Could it just be some space debris or broken meteor in low orbit. I'm only guessing but Because the moon has no atmosphere cant objects orbit lower to the surface? Also I read that the core of the the moon when it was still molten was pulled towards the earth by gravity and therefor the now solidified core isn't central but nearer to the surface facing us than it is the dark side of the moon, hence why the surface we can see isn't anywhere near as cratered as the 'back' because of past concentrated volcanic activity 'replenishing' the surface. Anyway what I'm trying to say is that if the denser core isn't central then this would surely alter the centre of gravity which could lead to irregular orbits?

Im just speculating but Fascinating whatever it may be...

Richard

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I've had a bit of a search of (obvious sets of) satellite TLEs, but the only stuff I can find that comes close (in position) is debris from FengYun 1C, but that is much too small to have registered on the video. I wonder if its military satellites whose TLEs aren't published?

As for the lunar-impacting meteoroid hypothesis: sorry, but it just doesn't run. If the "blobs" we are looking at are at lunar distance, they are huge and impacts would (a) easily have been detected by lunar seismographs and (:D have been spectacular.

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Sorry if I gave the impression that what we are seeing in the video was meteors, I was just commenting that the picture I took, was suggested by a friend that it may have been a meteor impact.

David

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I didn't even realise anyone had suggested an impact. I'll have to have another read through and check the links above.

Richard

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Interesting :D

What it's not is meteor related for the reasons Tetenterre gives, nor is it occultations as the objects are seen with the moon behind them, nor is it dirty optics as anything that close to the sensor would be...a) completely out of focus if it was on the objective, and :p look like a dust bunny if it was closer.

Could be a flight of birds at very high altitude though.

Rob.

Edited by RobH

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As for the lunar-impacting meteoroid hypothesis: sorry, but it just doesn't run. If the "blobs" we are looking at are at lunar distance, they are huge and impacts would (a) easily have been detected by lunar seismographs and (:D have been spectacular.

Okay, I'll buy that. It's not meteors.

As to space debris, there aren't that many options. NASA keeps track of space junk, so does ESA. So what are we talking about?

These objects are simultaneous but quite spread out. If it's space debris close to the Moon, which it looks like, why are they so far apart?

Interesting

Could be a flight of birds at very high altitude though.

Rob.

If I saw just one object go the other way, or be slightly off rather than right on the Moon horizon, it would be more convincing. But it's possible I guess.

Edited by Heliocentric

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Completely NOT an expert, but it really does look like a star occultation to me. Id say that the sudden appearence of them near the edge of the moon might have something to do with how the ccd/software was handling contrast.

Similarly, would it be possible that what appears as the lunar limb is actually just ccd bakeout (or something similar)... hence the objects can pass across it before disappearing?

Edited by the_laughing_crow

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Completely NOT an expert, but it really does look like a star occultation to me. Id say that the sudden appearence of them near the edge of the moon might have something to do with how the ccd/software was handling contrast.

Similarly, would it be possible that what appears as the lunar limb is actually just ccd bakeout (or something similar)... hence the objects can pass across it before disappearing?

I could agree with that explaination as you can see the glow around the moon however the one at 43 seconds traverse over the glow and onto the visable lunar surface vanishes then for a split second re-appears...maybe a hole in the cheese let it through?:D

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I just watched the video on a large screen, and it is my opinion that there is another object on the lower right side of the Moon at 0:47.

You'll have to watch the smaller picture on the left to see it. Could someone confirm?

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I just watched the video on a large screen, and it is my opinion that there is another object on the lower right side of the Moon at 0:47.

You'll have to watch the smaller picture on the left to see it. Could someone confirm?

Well spotted I see it too.

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