BillyBoyBoy

My 16" Orion XX16g dob setup here in Texas. That's a 16 x 20 foot piece of outdoor turf that in the summer, i stargaze barefoot. Good times!

Thanks Marco! Your reviews were key to my decision. Texas has been subject to a change in the jetstream over the last year or so, resulting in lots of blog reading at night... cloudy days and nights seemingly for a whole year, but we're finally starting to see some clear skies on a regular basis again.

A sleeping bag suit! Brilliant!! I searched "wearable sleeping bag".. LOL What a great time to be alive 😁

Thank you! Hey, it seemed a good thing to put together with the rain and clouds. Yes, this scope keeps its collimation very well in use, and even in moving the scope short distance in the process as I described above. The Argo Navis doesn't weigh enough to have any practical effect, but the handle was where I was going to put a counterweight had I ended up needing one. An update to my report... Use of the Solar Aperture Mask: I had a sunny day today and with the appearance of the mighty 2750 region (not), I pulled the scope out with my white light filter. The scope did great with the filter on, and the variety of apertures in the mask did make a detectable difference, especially at higher magnifications. Collimation: As with any dob, it's good practice to collimate every time you use the thing, and of course the Sumarians must be collimated when they're built. The tough thing about collimating these scopes vs a regular dob is the fact that when building it, the secondary has to be put on the spider, vs it just staying on from use to use. Having to reaffix the secondary when you build the scope means some extra attention you have to give to the squareness to the focuser. I had enough of that challenge today and came up with this: It's just a piece of cardstock that has a hole for the beam from my laser collimator to go through. Being able to see where the laser beam is on its return trip from the primary mirror enabled me to get the secondary affixed quickly and squarely with the focuser to have little to dial in on the primary. As you can see in the pic, I even was able to see the dot on the paper in the secondary's reflection in the primary. Woot! The top of the paper had a bit of Velcro on it to set it in place with the hole centered on the back of the focus tube. Good times! Bill

I have been using what I consider to be the game changer with cold weather gear in our hobby. There's not a lot of moving around in what we do, and I when I get cold, I'm miserable. As I approached my first winter a few years ago in my re-entry into astronomy, I stumbled across heated clothing. I found a brand called Gerbing that makes heated liner clothing for motorcyclists... and with a suit that's interconnected and plugged in to the motorcycle's 12V "cigarette lighter" port. I put one piece coveralls over it all to keep the heat in and I'm set. So I got a 110V/220V transformer that outputs 12V DC and got the suit. I can stay out all night in freezing temperatures and stay cozy warm under the stars. Now, this stuff is a little spendy, but it's lasted me 5 years now with no issues and I expect the suit to last a long time. As much as I hate the cold, it's the only way I can get out in the winter to stand around a telescope or lay on the ground to watch the Geminids. I considered it an investment to allow my hobby to be possible year-round. Check it out: https://www.gerbing.com/how-it-works Bill

Hello, all. I got the scope, messed with it, and decided to write about it, but it turned into a review of sorts. So I decided to start a new thread... https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/343636-sumerian-alkaid-12-review-and-mods/ It's been really rainy and cold here, so I've had some time to put together a doozy of a post! Bill

Well hello again! It's only been almost a year since I last posted about my acquisition of a Sumerian Optics scope (https://stargazerslounge.com/topic/325179-binos-on-a-sumerian-alkaid-12/), and all my queries about how well binos worked with them. Please pardon the delay... life got in the way to the extreme. Thank you BGazing for the nudge to get back to it. In that thread, the topic was mainly about asking around about anyone’s experience with binoviewers on a Sumerian Alkaid 12", but my posting here ends up being a little more of a review, so I thought a new thread with an appropriate title would be the proper thing to do. I'm gonna nerd out here pretty hard, but it's the sort of stuff that I look for when I'm doing all that research on what to get in the frst place. I wanted to share, because the things I've done to the scope has made the experience even better than it already was, and if it's inspiration to anyone on their own ideas on making the thing their own, well that's awesome. So I ordered the Sumerian Alkaid 12" f/5 in December of 2018. The intent to get a travel was prompted by my plans to go to Chile for the July 2, 2019 total solar eclipse. I figured ordering as early as I did would allow Sumerian Optics to build and ship the scope in time. It got hung up in US Customs in Nashville, Tennessee and showed up at my door the day before I got back from Chile! 😖 Oy! Anyhow, the scope is here and I unpacked it with great enthusiasm. It was well packed (spooley storm), and the box (as shipped from Teleskop Express) contained the manufacturer's box (the one Sumerian shipped to Teleskop Express). It was to my relief that the manufacturer's box had my name in big letters on the box. It was a relief because my scope was to come with a specially-ordered Moonlite focuser (their choice of focuser, but my choice of model) with a 2.7" focus travel to accommodate all three magnification settings on my Denkmeier Binotron 27 binoviewer. In purple. One helpful note: As I’m in the United States, I could only order a Sumerian scope through Teleskop Express. They were not very good at communication, and though I can’t say whether or not the language barrier was a factor, they just didn’t seem to want to answer questions. That’s the impression I got, anyway. However, I did contact Michael, the owner of Sumerian Optics and the builder of the scopes, and that made all the difference. I was able to ask my questions about considerations with binoviewer usage and I was able to choose the focuser to best suit my needs. In my case, that 2.7” of focus travel. In purple. As stated before in other reviews, the instructions were good enough to figure out and I easily had the scope built. Given that the purchase of a new telescope causes cloudy weather, I took it out for first light a few nights later when the sky decided to stop taunting me. The mirror is the standard GSO mirror... I did not opt for the fused quartz mirror. I understand the quartz is superior in terms of lower thermal expansion and lighter weight for the application, but I didn't find the benefits valuable enough to me to pay the extra coin. The mirror I got is a fine mirror. It’s a bit heavy, but it's consistent and clean. It’s as bright as I hoped it would be and have read in other reviews. I do not perceive any coma around the edges of the field, so there's no need for corrective lensing like the Paracorr. Perhaps a greater chance for coma on the faster f/4.5 version, but not the f/5. By the way, my Denks have the OCR-45, which is their big aperture one. I use the binos with both of my dobs and it comes to focus in them, no problem. I also got the encoder set, which is an option at Teleskop Express when ordering. I bought an Argo Navis to read the encoders and I added a SkyBT to enable it to talk with my Android mobile's SkySafari app. This makes the scope a "push-to", which is my first experience with that. I have a dob with go-to, and I love it. The push-to is fantastic. What a clever alternative to go-to/motors! For those that don't know, that means I can select an object in SkySafari and press the go-to command (or on the Argo Navis itself) and the Argo Navis tells me to move each axis in a certain direction and it tells me in arcminutes how far I have to push or how far past I've gone to get to the object. Well, I just think that's cool. LOL The bonus to the Alkaid as a push-to with the Argo Navis and the SkyBT is that the Argo Navis and SkyBT are battery operated. That means I can use the system stand-alone without having to plug anything in and still have totally assisted navigaton. The push-to also renders the red dot finder used only for initial alignment, and then you can shut it off and forget about it. Also, the scope settles down quickly after moving the alt and az. The scope is stable when viewing. The encoder set comes with cabling, which I modified. More on that later. The fantastic and inspiring review by GuLinux (below) covers most of what I'd say about the scope, but I will speak to a few new things here. By the way GuLinux, your review was a key to my decision to go with this scope, so thank you! Yup, I watched the video of you guys building it, and everything else you put up about it. So I'm hopefully passing it forward. I tend to "pimp things out". I would suppose back at or before Thomas Edison's time, I would have done quite well, and all the while not being a total jerk to Nikola Tesla. What I mean is that I seem to know how to take some simple aspect of something and engineer a way to vastly improve upon it, even if it was pretty good to begin with. For me, geeking out on the mods are half the fun of getting a system together. And after my customizations, I literally have the system perfect so when I use the scope, it's exactly the way I want it so I can focus on the use of it and not be fooling with even the slightest shortcoming or inconvenience that I might have experienced with any of the original system. 1) Balancing the Scope The scope comes with two pretty stout bungee cords (aka “shock cords”) to create balance using tension rather than counterweights. I had originally anticipated that I would need some sort of counterweight to accommodate the added weight of my binos. It was even something that the owner of Sumerian Optics had suggested I consider and/or additional bungees. The bungees fasten to the scope base on and around these pins that screw in that stick out of the side of the base and the side of the mirror box. Each bungee has a loop on each end to go on a pin and the middle of the bungees do a turn around other pins. This creates tension as, when the scope is tilted, the pins spread apart from each other and stretch the bungee. The suggested configuration of putting the bungees on was fine as my starting point, but when I put on the binos, it wasn't enough. So I ran the bungees in other configurations around the pins and even used a couple of the knobs there around where the pins are... et voila! Therefore, I am happy to report that with a 4.5 lb set of binos, the Denk's "filter switch" and "power switch", and two little glass-packed footballs for eyepieces, I do not need counterweights. I simply needed to play with the bungee configuration until I got it right. Eyepiece side - Manufacturer’s bungee configuration suggestion: (left) vs my solution (right): Far side - Manufacturer’s bungee configuration suggestion: (left) vs my solution (right): PS... my way of doing it (the ones to the right) supports the weight of my 4.5 lb Denkmeier Binotrons at ANY angle the scope is at. This is a bona fide solution for the bino, folks. 2) Getting a Full Shroud The "shroud" that the scope comes with is a round piece of thick vinyl-like fabric that fastens to the top of the scope. It's just a light shield at the eyepiece. You really need a full shroud to protect the primary from dust and dew, plus a full-length shroud is critical when using the scope for solar viewing with a white light filter. Like GuLinux, I used the knobs that go to that shield elsewhere for one of my modifications. I ordered a shroud from "Shrouds by Heather" (https://www.scopeshrouds.com/), which is a US company that also makes the Teeter's Telescopes. Husband and wife thing... great folks. I made the measurements and ordered a full-length shroud. When I got it, I found it to be a bit long, which was my fault, so I took it to a tailor to have it shortened a bit. Note: If you order a shroud, make sure to ask for rounded elastic cord to be used instead of flat, ribbon-like elastic. The elastic has to fit over knobs on the scope and the flat ribbon elastic doesn’t sit as well. Also don’t forget about having a focuser cut-out done. I got the shroud back from the tailor, and it fits the scope perfectly. The proper length to indicate should be 46.5 inches. Of course, it's pouring rain outside, so when I see the sun out again, I will get the scope out with the shroud on and put on the white light filter to check out the sun. 3) My White Light Solar Filter Attachment I bought some corrugated polypropylene board. It's like corrugated cardboard, but made out of white plastic, and it is acceptably stiff for the application here. I essentially made a big dial that allows me to select one of three different size aperture masks according to the seeing/magnification. I've read that it does make a difference and I've read elsewhere that it might not, but I made it anyway. The apertures are of course in between the spider vanes, and the fourth space is the blank selection where there is no hole in the mask. That setting is what I'd use for transporting the mask. I also have an IR/UV cut filter at the end of the binoviewers to further reduce any UV radiation that the white light filter transmits through. Now where the hell is the sun???? 4) My Customizations Low Altitude Stop: I found that if you try and go too low in altitude with the scope, the scope will literally "fall off its rocker" and with bungees in tension, it is not only a very startling jolt when it happens, but you then have to undo all the bungees to get the scope back on its track. It needed a limiting plate, so I fashioned one out of aluminum plate. Problem solved. And it's attractive. Argo Navis Mount: Instead of having some stalk to hold the Argo Navis like you see on some rigs, I wondered how I could mount it on some existing part where the display would be visible when doing the push-to thing, in a good place for the cables, and to be out of the way and clean from a cabling standpoint. The suitcase handle is on the back side of the primary mirror box, and what I found as the perfect place to affix the Argo Navis. I riveted some velcro to the plastic holder that came with the Argo Navis and put velcro on the bottom of the handle for a secure attachment. God I love Velcro. I have a spool of the stuff that has an adhesive backing so strong that I literally need pliers to pull off the stuff if I don't get it on there right. Given that, I use tweezers for careful placement. Cabling: The cables that come with the encoder kit are LONG, and it may be because some folks like their Argo Navis on a stalk. Per the above solution, I shortened the cables (need crimpable connectors and a crimp tool of course). That eliminated the coils of excess cabling, but I had the issue of the cable that bunches up at the back when you take the altitude of the scope to straight up. At that point, or anywhere near it, you now have a potential for the cable to snag on the base or something on the ground. As I'm sure I have made you realize by now, that just wouldn't do, so I bought some 8-conductor curly ethernet cord (like an old landline phone cord... remember?). This would keep the cable off the ground and out of the way, and would stretch when the scope's altitude was taken closer to the horizon. Gosh, that's really fussy, but it's a good mod and I am certainly unconcerned about snags now. Sorry, I'm a bit of a freak show about tidy cables. The leftmost is the shortened cabling, eliminating all that excess cable. The next pic shows how I color code the connectors where they mate with a spot of nail polish. The third pic shows one of the two bungee-string strain reliefs on the curly cord. This takes the stress off the connectors entirely. The rightmost two pictures shows the curly cord in action with telescope at vertical, and then at horizontal. Sexy! Secondary Knobs: The secondary mirror comes off, which is part of the scope's ability to break down into a suitcase, but doing collimation becomes a pain when you only have knobs on two of the three pressure points. I think I took a knob from the unused shield and used that, or I bought one, and now collimation is as easy as it should be. I'm not sure why Sumerian does that two-knob thing. I consider it the only real design consideration shortcoming of the entire system. Well, maybe that and the low altitude stop. GuLinux suggested this, as have a few others, and it is the way to go. One thing of note: As the secondary is detachable, that means the secondary is only held in place in use on the telescope with nothing more than the pressure these three knobs put on the mount plate on the back of the secondary. There is a dew heater, and a cable off a spider vane plugs in to a port on the secondary assembly. This does double as a bit of a fall safety connection, as in the case you lose grip of the secondary with the knobs and the secondary assembly falls, the cable will keep it from crashing down into your primary or onto the floor/ground. BUT… you’ve got those knobs too. One just has to be careful with getting the secondary mounting done slowly and carefully. Added Storage: There are a couple of bits that don't seem to have a place in the "suitcase" - but should, such as the altitude encoder arm - so I simply put in Velcro on the bits and the inside of the base to get it all in there. I also have a little bag with a soft interior that I put over the secondary mirror after I mount it to the inside of the base... just to protect it a little more. Once you have the "suitcase" complete, you have all the pins, the knobs, the bungees, the encoder cabling, the Argo Navis, the SkyBT, the truss poles, and the shroud left to store separately. In addition to the white light attachment, it all goes in a backpack, with all the little parts stored in Crown Royal bags I’ve accumulated through the years. I honestly don't know why I have so many Crown Royal bags. I don't remember drinking that much Crown. 😜 Ah, youth. Altitude Encoder Arm: If you need to move the scope, you can pick up the scope "tube" off its base with relative ease... it's very lightweight. You just have to hold it on both its mirror box's handle and the top aperture ring so as not to stress the truss poles. You run too much risk of having a tragic accident if you try and pick up the whole thing together, scope and base, because that has you holding the base and you've run out of hands to keep one hand on the scope. So you get the scope part off the base and set it aside so you can move the base to where you want it, then pick up the scope and place it on the base again. Now if you have the encoders, the altitude encoder is affixed to an aluminum swing arm that attaches to both the mirror box and the base to allow measurement of the altitude. Problem is, when you lift the scope off its base and then go to set it down, you get that swing arm in the way and you risk bending it. Yes, you can remove the swing arm for short distance transport, always super fun to fiddle with little knobs, but when tired of that I've found that if you put a little piece of loop Velcro on the inside of the arm and a little piece of hook Velcro on the knob conveniently placed near the arm, you can do a little move and get the swing arm to come up and stick and stay so you can set the scope tube down without the arm getting in the way. It seems like a little thing until you need to move the scope and you don't remove the swing arm. Once you restore the scope to its base, you can carefully tilt the scope off its track on the altitude sensor/swing arm side and get the end of the swing arm on its pin where it normally resides in operation. A Little Idiot-Proofing: The more I can do to remove the "now, which way does this thing go together?" moment, the better. Especially with a kit like this that breaks down into a lot of parts. Maybe I just like playing with my label maker. 5) My Kit Aside from the binos and the EPs, the pic to the left is the whole thing, with all the parts and my mods in the backpack. In my modification efforts, I go all the way with it. I consider storage and safe keeping of the accessories, and I consider the means by which the entire kit is transported. Here's a picture of that kit, which can go on my back while I carry the "suitcase", or put the backpack in a regular luggage suitcase. On a plane, I would have my lovely assistant have the binos/EPs case as her carry on, and all delicate optics are safe from getting tossed about by the baggage handlers. In taking the pic of the whole kit, I couldn't help but give a nod to GuLinux's girlfriend's toes... I love this telescope, and now I have not only a scope fit to transport on an airplane, and a scope with big aperture potential for white light solar, but also a quick “get-and-go” scope for impromptu viewing wherever I go or at home. It is such a good scope. Bill

Ok, folks... I pulled the trigger. I'm getting the Sumerian Alkaid 12" f/5 with standard glass!! Woot! Since I'm a yank, I have to get it through Teleskop Service, but I reached out directly to Michael with Sumerian and asked about the chances of getting a focuser with 2.5" of travel to accommodate my binos. He said as long as I was good with Moonlite, he could order those for my scope when he builds it. Sweet! Big credit to him for being so accommodating. Looks like I'll be getting it hopefully sometime in the spring. I'm getting the digital setting circles kit, which he installs when he builds. One question... has anyone ever done white light solar with an Alkaid 12"? I know I'll be doing it with an off axis mask, but I was wondering if anyone's had some experience with any specific hardware that fits the scope well and seems to be a winning choice. From the looks of it online, the OTA end is a flat plate rather than a tube, so I'm wondering if a homemade mask with some glass or film will be my choice. Thanks!

Hey, if having to refocus is the worst of it, that's not bad. Actually, I like coming into focus when I change magnification, because it's like a surprise on what I'm going to see at a higher magnification. It's like a little added wow factor, like a reveal. On my 16" dob, I found that swapping the focuser out for one with 2.5" of travel allowed me to focus on all three power switch settings. Before the swap, I could focus to two settings, but I would have to pull out or push in for the third one. Now that was a hassle. I asked about getting the focuser swapped with the Alkaid, but it didn't sound like that was something they were willing to accommodate. Having said that, I understand that the stock focuser is a Moonlite and it's low-profile and lighter weight, which will help with the top-heaviness that I will be adding with the binos. Still, it is nice to be able to get all three settings and focus without having to move to binos up and down. Speaking of Barlow, on a crystal clear night and the seeing is in rare form, I have taken a 2X Powermate and put it in line with the binos, set the power switch to 3x, and put the 12 mm in for eyepieces. In my 16" dob, it's something ridiculous like 900x, and with excellent seeing, gets pretty outrageous magnification on planets. Of course it also sticks out about two feet out of the side of the scope! I can pull that off about twice a year with seeing around here. Bill

Nicoscy, not sure how you ever got out of the binoviewer game, but if you had to drop some coin on something for visual, binos is certainly the ticket. I'm a really big value researcher, and for value, versatility and fit/finish, I highly recommend the Denkmeier Binotron 27s. On mine, I have both the filter switch, which holds two filters of either 1.25" or 48 mm, which you can slide in and out, and the power switch, which allows you to switch three different magnifications. Stu, I have the Denkmeier OCS 45. I don't mind the slight magnification effect of it and with it, the lowest power on the bino's "power switch" is a 1.3 X effect. With the two pairs of eyepieces that I utilize with the binos, I have fields of view that I'm pretty happy with. It's no 2.5° TFOV, but then again, I'm talking use on a newt. I'm waiting for my refractor to come as I'm on a waitlist, but I can't wait to see the views with the binos in that. Having said that, if I wanted to dial the magnification further down than the OCS will afford with my current eyepieces, I would just get longer focal length eyepieces. I am using Baader 24 mm Hyperions right now (68°) and Meade 12mm HD60s (60°). IMO I think it's a sweet spot with the binos for the power switch's 1.3x to 3x range of effect. All said, it's interesting to understand what the OCS is actually doing a little better. Bill

I've got an OCS for my binos, so I wasn't worried about coming to focus. Just curious, why would one choose cutting the scope length vs just using an OCS? Bill

Ok gang, I pulled the trigger. My Sumerian Alkaid 12" f/5 should be in my hot little hands in 3 to 4 months. The culmination of the advisement I got (thanks to y'all, Teleskop Express and Sumerian, and research I did sets me on the following path in the use of the scope with my Denk binos: 1) Counterweight the bottom with a sand- or water-fillable weight to travel empty of course to keep my luggage lighter. 2) Use some greater tension bungees to work with the counterweight. 3) Install the sensor kit for digital setting circles and utilize an Argo Navis to make the scope a push-to with a SkyBT to work with my Sky Safari on Android. Can't wait for things to start arriving! Bill

10-4 will do Thank you, Stephan. Bill

Guten tag! I checked out the Hofheim 12" (thank you Stephan). They utilize a counterweight at the bottom that is to be filled with water and or sand, which is the approach I planned on taking with the Sumerian. Only downside is the number and size of the cases. Two cases, which wasn't really a deal killer, as only the case with the mirrors would need carry on, but neither case has all three L x W x H dimensions less than or equal to carry on specs. One is 9cm x 41cm x 41cm and the other is 17cm x 45cm x 50cm. My only concern is that with carry on specs of 22cm x 35cm x 56cm, my luck the airline will fuss about being slightly over, especially on a full plane, and the risk of having to check the case will always be there. I've read some airlines are ok with adding up the dimensions to accept a total of 115cm or less, some are more strict to the individual dimensions. One thing I will not check is a mirror or an objective lens. If it wasn't a dumb idea to take apart my TEC 140, I'd be traveling with that. Digging in to learning about the Hofheim certainly led me to other dob makers that never would have shown up on my radar. http://www.sud-dobson.fr/clemain.html http://www.dietermartini.de/ https://www.maison-astronomie.com/telescopes-dobson/3021-dobson-nadirus-12.html#/334-version_opt_monture_moteurs-with_optics http://www.dobsonians.co.uk/Ultra Portable.htm Pretty neat approaches to a travel dob, though not small enough to carry on, still pretty cool. I like the last one. That's a serious dude right there. More to come, including Michael's feedback from Sumerian. Bill

Thank you all for your insight! What can I say, I'm hooked on binos. Stereo visual is just that worth it IMO. It's just so easy to get lost in visual observation with it. My goal isn't necessarily traveling lightweight, as much as it is being able to carry on a plane. Just the size the 12" breaks down to, being less than carry-on restrictions, is definitely what piqued my interest. I did get a response from Teleskop Express (the only dealer that I've found that ships to the US) that suggested I have a counterweight as well as bungee array. I'll give Michael at Sumerian a shout, too, for his thoughts on my intent with the binos. Nicoscy, I have an OCS for the binos, and I figured I'd need it for this dob, too. I have it for my 16" dob at home (the one that doesn't fit in the overhead compartment) with the extension tube, etc. As far as focal ratio, it sounds like the f/5 is for me. A Paracorr is just more weight, and binos are already pushing it. I'm somewhat tall, so eyepiece height with longer poles sounds like another selling point on the f/5. Ill check out that Walk Stool, too. Thanks for all the info. Super helpful. More to come when I get my responses from both Teleskop and Sumerian. Now please excuse me while I learn German ? Cheers!

Anybody ever used binos on a Sumerian 12"? I have a pair of Denkmeier Binotron 27s and I'm looking to acquire the scope as a travel dob. Just wondering how well it handles the weight of the binos, or not... I have read that using more bungee cords is helpful. Also, I see that there are two focal ratios available for the Alkaid - f/4 and f/5 - and if someone has used binos with the scope, which one might be a better choice for acquiring focus. Thanks! Bill