PlanetGazer

6 minutes ago, Alan64 said:

In turn, I had forgotten about the dew-shield, in this case a light-shade...

https://stargazerslounge.com/uploads/monthly_04_2011/post-21419-133877556647.jpg 71.11 kB · 0 downloads

sorry for this question, but won't the shield extend the focal length of the telescope? which could be an advantage for fast telscopes

Thanks! Very good info. I already use a LP filter and observe objects that are only high and at a manageable angle, to tackle the atmosphere and LP issues.

I will consider flocking and using a cloth, wonder what will my neighbors think of the blanket xD

On 05/07/2019 at 20:25, Alan64 said:

Quite a few double-stars require higher powers to split them, and to see the differing colors.  A short-focus achromat(refractor) and a short-focus Newtonian/"Dobsonian" are going to be problematic in that regard.

Still, refractors and Maksutovs are best for double-star observations.

In so far as light-pollution, there are several ways to lessen its effects whilst observing, and with some requiring a bit of DIY, arts-and-crafts type work.

Would love to hear about the arts and crafts that would reduce the effects of Light Pollution

7 hours ago, Wavseeker said:

First off thank you so much for these responses. I did some research myself and it kinda confirms what I found. You cannot beat a dobsonian in price per aperture.

I found this beauty online and in terms of money it's a little bit less than that skywatcher. How does orion compare to skywatcher? Are they the same quality? 

https://www.astroshop.eu/telescopes/orion-dobson-telescope-n-254-1200-skyquest-xt10i-intelliscope-dob/p,33295

I will also look at that website first light optics. 

Btw I'm from Belgium maybe that plays a role in choosing my online shop? 

Note that this is a Push to and not a GoTo, a goto track the object, while a Push to shows vertical and horizontal arrows pointing to the object for you to find.

For your budget I would go for the scope in the below quote (250 Dob) , or maybe the 200 Dob with savings for other accessories. If this is your first scope, visit a shop or local society to try. Maybe consider a small scope to try before spending this budget.

Best of luck

15 hours ago, Sunshine said:

Welcome to SGL, I can assure you this scope will tick all your boxes and provide you with years upon years of night sky amazement, This is a goto model, considering your budget you may also want to consider the same scope but without the goto feature, this will leave you with money to spare for some more eyepieces. Its a tossup between goto and affording some nice eyepieces which WILL greatly enhance your experience. Having said that, if you were to spring for the goto model then save up and get a few eyepieces one at a time then its a win win situation for you, either way, there are many on this forum who have the same scope and can certainly attest to their versatility and quality. From an aperture for dollar ratio POV, you just cant beat a Dobsonian.

These Skywatcher flex tube scopes are built well, perform, and are easy to use, I have used my friends 250P many times and if I didn't already have a dob, I wouldn't hesitate on one frankly.

 https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-250px-flextube-goto.html

On 23/07/2019 at 14:35, heliumstar said:

Barlowing the 6mm with Baader 2.25x barlow will get you down to 2.7mm. Is that something you need?

Turret is a nice addition but I rarely used it.

I would also check amazon.co.uk for these eyepieces Sometimes they can be had for as low as 32 GBP.

not planing to use this magnification on my current scope. I just ordered a 10 inch dob   and will give this magnification a go. though a Barlow is always welcomed, specially when it has a different magnification magnitude (2.25), could be combined with the 18mm & 32mm , to give "equivalent" eyepiece powers that I don't have (8 & 14 )

On 23/07/2019 at 19:18, Ricochet said:

Be aware that using the turret requires about 35mm of focuser in travel. With the 130/eq2 I doubt that you have that much available. 

Thanks for the heads up, will use it on a bigger scope.

On 23/07/2019 at 19:32, John said:

I reviewed the eyepieces, but not the turret, a while back. Link on FLO's website here:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/blog/baader-classic-ortho-plossl-review.html

They are pretty high quality optically but I think the turret might pose some problems with the scopes you own because of lack of focuser travel.

 

 

 

Thank you John, a well informative review!

On 21/07/2019 at 22:20, heliumstar said:

I looked through them using 150mm f5 Newtonian and they worked perfectly.

I would get 32mm, 18mm and 10mm and barlow. You already have 5mm eyepiece and if you get 6mm one of them would be redundant - depends on the scope really. The 6mm is very tight and might be difficult to use.

It is a very nice set, usable in many scopes. I especially like the 18mm. Somehow it very clear and comfortable.

 

Thanks for the feedback

As for the 6mm I agree it's redundant, but could be better with a Barlow than the 5 mm I already have? though It will be cheaper to buy the whole set than get the pieces and turret individually

1 hour ago, Geoff Lister said:

I have had my SW Skyliner 250PX Synscan GoTo for several years, and have no regrets.

Geoff

I appreciate your comment!

So I stumbled upon the Baader Classic Eyepiece Set with Q Turret, 

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/eyepiece-sets/baader-classic-eyepiece-set-with-turret.html

The content  of the set:

Baader 2.25X Q Barlow
Classic Ortho 6mm
Classic Ortho 10mm
Classic Ortho 18mm
Classic Plossl 32mm
Q-Turret quad eyepiece revolver
Baader Astro Box

What I currently own:

- Standard SkyWatcher 25 mm EP and the 10mm EP

-Standard SW 2X barrlow (which i hear is good?)

- The 5mm Celestron X-Cel LX EP

I'm not familiar with quality of EPs, and have a weak background in this subject. I'm considering the set but not sure if they are worth the price?

I currently use the SW 130 EQ2, but considering the SW 250 Flextube dob, which is F 4.7, are the Badeer sets good enough for the F 4.7 telescope?

An update:

I think I have been hit by aperture fever! Thanks to some of the comments here, I have changed my mind to the 10 inch dob and have stretched my budget xD I'm seriously thinking of buying the 250px SW Goto now, I've settled on the decision of buying a GoTo at some-point , tracking of objects is something I'm keen on, so I guess I should get it on the 10 inch I'm planning to buy.

What do you think? Am I going crazy? is it worth the price or should I wait for a better time to buy? I appreciate your criticism and honest opinion.

Straight to the topic:

This may affect our skies and our hobby completely. The video:

On 20/06/2019 at 20:59, niallk said:

I too have a 250px solid tube manual dob.

Great scope!!

I too was considering an 8" dob as my first scope.  I was looking at the Orion.  Wolfi at TS helpfully suggested that i could go for a SW 10" for about the same price - and im glad i did as DSOs were prime targets for me.

If you are considering the cost+weight of motors, perhaps consider increased aperture instead.

So I'd suggest considering 'Other': the Bresser 10" ... primarily because of the alt bearings.

https://www.astroshop.eu/telescopes/bresser-dobson-telescope-n-254-1270-messier-hexafoc-dob/p,52181

oh well, you are making me scratch my head for the 10 inch dobs, although not sure about their portability and ease of transport. The bresser base looks more fancy, but not worth the price difference compared to SW 10 Dob, imo.

On 17/06/2019 at 15:49, johninderby said:

The flex tube OTA is actually heavier than the solid tube. All the additional bits need to make the tube collaspable weigh more than just a bit of plain tube.

I think his point of a solid tube, was to have the option of using it on an EQ mount, since  the eq mount connect to rings that hold the tube with friction.

7 hours ago, Astro-Geek said:

You're right, I always wondered why Skywatcher don't appear to have produced a solid 8 inch goto.

When I was searching, I did find an Orion one, the  N 203/1200 SkyQuest XT8 IntelliScope.

https://www.astroshop.eu/telescopes/orion-dobson-telescope-n-203-1200-skyquest-xt8-intelliscope-dob/p,33297

(apologies for not posting an Alo link, they don't seem to do Orion scopes.)

At £630 including shipping to the UK it's quite a bit cheaper than the Skywatcher 200 flextube goto, but it is a "push to" instead, which is better in some respects IMHO.  The Az and Alt sensors enable the same object finding, but you push it to the indicated angles instead of the motors doing it and there is no tracking, so it will not follow an object.

I found that Retro fitting goto to a Dobsonian is expensive and not straightforward. Each mount is quite specific with non-standard bearings.

I therefore went for a simple DIY azimuth scale on the base and  a cheapo clone of a  magnetic "wixey" electronic angle gauge.  Costing only a few pounds these are so simple to attach and use.  Once calibrated on a horizontal surface, they just attach to the OTA near the top and give a precise alt angle of whatever it's pointing at.  I then just use an android tablet (or phone) running a free stellarium type app to search for an object and then point the Dob in the expected location.  It may be less accurate than an electronic goto and there's no tracking, but it gets me within a degree or so, and the additional "brainpower" steps of transferring the angles is more satisfying somehow. 🤓

 

 

Further to what you have posted, I also found a goto one, but it's very expensive !

 https://www.amazon.com/Orion-10134-Computerized-Dobsonian-Telescope/dp/B003E8K53C

6 hours ago, johninderby said:

You could make your own solid tube goto. I did a 250px version a few years ago by combining a Skywatcher newt OTA with a GOTO base. Makes you wonder why Skywatcher doesn’t offer this as an option. They would probably say not enough demand but I think there would be.

Did you buy the stand separately?  Or did it came with another telescope?

2 hours ago, Astro-Geek said:

Lots of good advice on here already.

My thoughts are that the flextube option is no advantage with a 200p because it's quite manageable as a rigid tube and it is possible to put it in standard rings for later EQ mounting.  I agree that the Bresser is halfway there already, just needing the dovetail, but it can be done with a skywatcher 200p too.

(But it would be pretty much impossible with a flextube).

The attached photo shows my "hybrid" 200PDS with dual Dobsonian mount and Rings/Dovetail.  They do fit, both together, just.

I bought it as a 200PDS with rings but then hankered for it to also be Dob mounted for quick "mobile" sessions.  I was lucky enough to find someone selling most of a used 200p Dob base, (the uprights, bearings etc.., all except the circular turntable base, which was fairly easily fabricated from 18mm MDF and a lazy susan bearing).

I retro fitted the large plastic Dobsonian Bearings to the OTA after careful measuring, and they happily co-exist with the standard rings and dovetail.  So it can be used as a Dob or simply lifted off and fixed to my EQ6 mount for Astro or accurate tracking.

I would however suggest that it's much easier to buy  the Dob version and then just add the rings, then there's no DIY modding and it can always revert to a pure Dob.

If I ever had to restrict myself to just one telescope (perish the thought.. 🤓), it would be this one, for maximum versatility and convenience.

Sir, what you have done there is amazing!

After reading your reply, I'm having second thoughts about the flex tube, but still would love a GoTo, which makes me wonder why I never found an 8 solid tube dob with a GoTo, how hard is it to assemble a GoTo to dub? wonder if GoTos are sold separately anyway?!

1 hour ago, Geoff Lister said:

Having enjoyed the Synscan GoTo with my Skymax 127mm Mak., I decided to increase my aperture with the Skyliner 250 flex-tube, and the same Synscan control. When stowed, I cover the OTA with an old bed-sheet to keep out dust. The truss tubes extend to very positive end stops, and so the OTA keeps collimation very well. I probably make minor adjustments about every 6 months.

The GoTo and tracking are very good, used mainly for visual observing, but with the GPCAM feeding my laptop, running SharpCap and its live stacking mode, seems to compensate for minor field rotation. It gives me a decent depth of colour when viewing DSOs.

Geoff

Thank you all for the advise!

14 hours ago, Cosmic Geoff said:

I would suggest that instead of choosing a telescope because you "like" it, you decide what you want to observe (or image) and buy equipment suitable for that function.  Being prepared to spend the price of a new 8" GoTo Dob gives you some leeway.

Some tips: Look at what serious deep-space or planetary imagers actually use.

What kind of visual telescope would you really like, taking cost out of the equation? Perhaps one half the length and weight of the equivalent Newtonian, with a more convenient eyepiece position that stays near one position, and a large focal range to accommodate accessories that add length to the light path?

Not having GoTo gives you a huge bias to only observing objects that are easy to find and track.

What kind of mount? These days you only really need an equatorial for long exposure astrophotography.   Mounts bundled with 8" telescopes vary

hugely  in ease of setup, portability, weight, stiffness and embedded cost.

A 8" Newtonian atop a EQ5 or similar mount is a pig to use, whether for visual or for astrophotography.

well my max budget is 750 quid, but would be nice if I can get a 200mm with third the price. I agree the GoTo 42,000 objects is amazing feature.

14 hours ago, fiestazetecmk2 said:

200p skyliner. Easy to use and set up.great veiws. Not heavy .no electronics to go wrong .maybe the only scope you'll ever need.

thank you for the feedback!

12 hours ago, 8472 said:

To add to all of the above, you can buy the Dob, build yourself an eq platform (which will track well enough for visual), buy a used camera tracker, used dslr and adapt an old M42 lens (all for widefield imaging) all in for roughly the price of the Flex tube.

That is exactly the way I did it and have no regrets. 

wow amazing, any topics on how you built your self an EQ mount for it?

2 hours ago, 8472 said:

If you eventually want to take the imaging route, you can forget the flex tube for anything serious.

Field rotation. 

2 hours ago, Nigella Bryant said:

As far as I know you'd only get max 20secs /30secs subs b4 field rotation takes affect. If eventually AP is your goal then better to get an equatorial mount. Just a thought. 

I would not consider AP seriously at the moment, and would prioritise the convenience of a dob for the time being. I have an SWatcher 130 with an EQ mount. Thanks of the replies, and can use that

2 hours ago, Vondragonnoggin said:

You can do EEVA eventually with the goto. Most EEVA exposures less than 30 seconds and generally faster than that.

 

You might consider a non-goto flex-tube also. It’s a little heavier actually than the solid tube, but with it collapsed, you can stuff the tube into a tighter space in a vehicle to drive it somewhere darker to view.

The solid tube and fully extended flex-tube will keep collimation duties about the same. Collapsing the flex-tube will definitely make you need to do collimation again. I used to keep mine extended for that reason. I only had to carry it down three stairs to my back deck so it kept collimation very well, but as soon as I collapsed it and re-extended, it needed collimation for sure.

 

I traded mine a few years back but it was a great scope for many years to me. I decided to try a few different scope types. Refractors and Maks now, but really enjoyed the flex-tube dob while I had it. It was traded for a Twilight II manual alt-az mount.

Great to hear that! I would have to research EEVA more

and I agree, flex would be more convenient for the car I have, but having the flex extended most of the time is not what I would I do where I live atm, dust is annoying here. May I ask why would the flex tubes bad for collimation?  collapsing the tube disrupt the mirror?

2 hours ago, R26 oldtimer said:

I would not consider a goto dob for anything smaller than 10" or 12".

There are better and more versatile mounts for scopes smaller than 12" such as the Heq5 or eq6 or the azeq equivalents. The dobsonian mount is a great concept when it comes to keep a large scope steady without having to pay as much as a car for a mount to hold  a 14"-16"-20".

So I would either go for the Skyliner 200P Dobsonian or a 12" manual dob or something like that:

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/reflectors/skywatcher-explorer-200pds-heq5-pro.html

 I read your point, but for me personally, I wouldn't go for larger than an 8 inch for portability reasons, and having a Dob is something I have been considering for a long time.

34 minutes ago, vlaiv said:

Goto feature is what accounts for bulk of additional cost.

It allows you to both find objects and track them. Such scope is not well suited for serious AP, but can be used for EEVA/EAA quite successfully. It can also be used for planetary imaging.

Not sure if flex version is useful for anything else except storage and transport (which is not huge issue with 8" scope anyway).

For me, goto would be useful for tracking when observing at higher magnifications - like Moon and the planets. However, for that purpose there is a cheaper solution that works almost as good (and in some respects even better) - EQ platform. It is "base" that you can put your dobsonian telescope on and it will track object for up to one hour before it needs "rewinding". It does not use continuous motion but rather tracks for certain segment of "circle" (because it is low lying platform and not full fledged EQ mount), after it reaches end of its motion, it needs to be "reset", or "rewinded" to start position (this is fairly easy to do and lasts about a minute). It is cheaper alternative even if buying it ready made, but can also be DIY project if you fancy that sort of thing - there are plenty of blueprints online for it. It suffers form one drawback - it is built for particular latitude (+/- few degrees) so it is useful for particular place but can be used on trips to local dark site.

If you after all decide to get proper EQ mount, then SW version of dob is not the best to get now. Look at Bresser 8" dob. This is because SW version has integrated parts for mounting to dob base - these are not easily removed and fitted back. Bresser dob has different solution - it uses tube rings, and it is much easier to transfer to EQ mount and back.

If you think of using such a large newtonian on EQ mount - please consider the fact that EP/focuser can end up in really strange positions and this is handled by rotating the OTA in its mounting rings. 8" newtonian can be as much as 10Kg in weight and rotating the scope in its rings is not as easy for such a large scope. If you want just to observe and/or do some planetary imaging, possibly EAA - either Goto or EQ platform is better solution.

I like the idea of tube rings for Dobs! found it https://www.bresser.de/en/Brand/Bresser/BRESSER-Messier-8-Dobsonian.html 

However, as I said, I'm not looking for an EQ, I know they are much better for tracking , but as you said the GoTo can help a little bit in tracking, I guess you convinced me of the Goto feature. I'm leaning towards the  Sky-Watcher Skyliner 200P FlexTube GOTO

Good Afternoon to all,

Glad to be back to this community, after a period of inactivity in my best hobby.

I may need your thoughts and help as I'm thinking of buying one of these 200mm/8inch Dobs:

* Sky-Watcher Skyliner 200P Dobsonian ( £275 )

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-200p-dobsonian.html

* Sky-Watcher Skyliner 200P FlexTube GOTO ( £749 )

https://www.firstlightoptics.com/dobsonians/skywatcher-skyliner-200p-flextube-goto.html

Both are Skywatcher 8 inch dobs, only difference is the collapsible/flex tube + the GoTo, as far as I know. The price difference is relatively huge, I understand that these two features are game changing but is it worth the difference? (roughly £90 for the added flex feature and £400 for adding a  GoTo to a telescope)

Personally, I'm after the flex-tube feature and couldn't find an 200 flex dob with no GoTo, which made me consider having a GoTo feature. Will the GoTo feature track an object ? as this may help me if I ever consider astro-photography.

On another note, is it possible to add a GoTo to a dob stand later on?

You help is much appreciated!

I'm not sure that expensive EPs have higher secondhand value, by buging new and sell used, you'll lose about 30% to 40% for EPs like BST up to TV or Pentax. In actually amont, you loose more money by buying new expensive EPs. The best way to save money is to buy used high quality EPs.

Sure the expensive EPs have high quality, but most money is paid to get wider field of view(FOV), better edge performance in the wider FOV in fast scopes and viewing comfort (eye relief e.g.). If you can live with narrower FOV and short eye relief, optically the baader classic ortho for £50 outperformce many EP cost many times more.

Just my two cents.

I don't think I mind the FOV yet, but I do care about eye relief, not sure what EP will fit this category. Thinking of the 5mm Celestron X-Cel LX, any other ideas?

Thanks for the replies all. I'm just not familiar with design names for the EPs and their specs. Would like to know the order from top to bottom, based on performance and FOV, like where does the plossil come in place?

Hmmmm, why not? Telescope aside, we're in danger of straying into contradiction land here! There are plenty of TV threads saying, "If you want the best, buy TV!" and "If I'd known at the beginning what I know now, I'd have bought TV from the start!". If he's got the money, why shouldn't he buy TV and have the best to begin with? He can always upgrade the 'scope after! 

Cheers

I do get your point, why not have the shortcut and save the money. But you'll never be confident enough to make that jump, you'll have to take it step by step , that's our nature X(

Edit: more.

agree. my next target ep would be 6mm/8mm ethos.

May I ask why ethos? Im in the same postion, and would like to know mote about EPs

I use 12" dob. recently, I bought 2 used tv eps which are naggler 22mm & 11mm. looking at jupiter with these eps amazed me so much. before, I can only see jupiter as a 2mm dot. now I see it as big as 6mm dot & the orange lines are clearly visible with those 4 moon. I guess I wont turning back... gonna sold my old eps & get the green. wew.... drown me further...

I'm pretty sure you can see a larger Jupiter with a 5 or 6 mm EP. 

Thanks for this. Am only a novice, but I think I do understand the 2 systems as you describe them.

my bad I just realized the date of the topic, I answered to the problem in the first post. 

You maybe mixing the two systems you find in mounts, the Alt-Azimuth and the equatorial. The equatorial is designed so that you can track an object easily based on your location/latitude. Maybe these pictures of the two grids will help differentiate between them.  

This is the normal vertical horizontal axis system from the normal perspective 

This is the system you have in your eq mount.

What's the fuss about? I tried to figure it out from the posts in first page, but no..I'm still a beginner