philj

Ive been meaning to do this comparion for some time, first chance tonight.

1975 ish Towa 339 80mm F15 compared to 1845 ish James Smith of London 3.25" F18 refractors using Olympus OM D EM 1 mirrorless camera.

I reckon the Towa has it but the antique uncoated Smith aint far behind

Towa 80mm F15

Smith 3.25" F18

Each scope was mounted in turn on my HEQ5

Heres a pic of the Smith on original mount, (Sporting non original dew shield), with Jupiter in the background

Finally managed to get a quick image through the 180 plus year old scope. I was hoping to get more subs so I could stack but by the time I had set up and got the first sub it was wall to wall cloud here.

Single test 1/100s 200asa  Olympus OM D EM 1. Sharpened and contrast in PS3 a bit noisy due to single sub but it shows promise.

Good image scale on the MFT chip at F16, fills the chip nicely.

That's what I thought John. I still have one somewhere around.

Carton Optics are well regarded in the vintage scope world and provided the objective is in good condition and hasn't been got at, the scope should do up well.

Agree with John, no finder and a Barlow has been wedged in the finder bracket with an eyepiece in it.

The diagonal is a Herschel wedge solar viewing prism and I would not recommend using it without some expert advice.

A standard prism/diagonal will be needed although I'm sure it will come to focus direct viewing but that can be uncomfortable.

Looks like the mount slow motions are missing also.

A good find I reckon

On 29/10/2023 at 22:32, The60mmKid said:

Uberkööl 😎 Can you post more pictures of the scope?

Thanks, herez a link to the scope details resto thread

2 hours ago, JeremyS said:

 

I love the contrast with the ultra modern EPs you used.

Its the only way i test these scopes. The old RAS eyepieces were ok in their day and are nice to look "AT" but not through. They are wanting on exit pupil, eyerelief and FOV mostly, so using a nice modern quality eyepiece is more comfortable and also shows how good or bad the objective is.

Apart from cleaning them and a brief test early on terrestrially I havent touched the brass eyepieces that came with it.

After restoring the Smiths of London 3.25" F16 refractor and getting it up an running on the hardwood field tripod the weather got in the way and I was only able to do a quick star test in the few weeks since. However when the forecast for last saturday showed clear skies, I was up for giving the scope a proper test.

So I set off through driving wind and rain up to the EMS dark site (Tannenbaum Campsite Belper).

Managed to get up there though I was wondering if it would be a wasted journey but  wow it was clear when I got up there.

I took the 3.25" Smith mainly to to test on Jupiter and Saturn but also have a wander around the skies the old fashioned way and I had a pleasant couple of hours testing.

Belper dark site may not be darker than my garden but the horizons are excellent, much better than my tree blocked garden.

Because the scope is big and there was quite a strong cold wind I set the scope up in the lee of my van for a bit of protection but even there the wind was still buffeting the scope highlighting the inherent  instability in this design of pillar mount.

The wood tripod I modified gave sterling performance though I was pleased to see but the wobbles were emanating from the brass pillar. I will bodge some tube rings up and fit this scope to my EQ5 next to give it a thorough test but at the moment it was sufficiently useable to check the scope out.

I was using Tak 24mm and TV Delite 18.2mm eyepieces throughout with my 1.25" to RAS adapter and the period prism diagonal that came with the scope which I modified to take 1.25" eyepieces as well. This gave 53 and 70x respectively, wobbly mount and atmospherics meant higher mags were not really useable. I soon found using the prism to be the more comfortable option despite the tripod being at a good height.

Planets

As the evening progressed and Jupiter rose higher out of the murk over Nottingham  Jupiter in the both eyepieces was sharp and showing the main belts really, well when the scope wasnt being blown around.

Saturn was a little jewel with the shadow of the rings on the globe evident when conditions allowed.

DSO

Now the period narrow field of view finder was making its limitations evident. The apeture is 1" and the FL quite long so it wasnt really much help except to point the scope at a brightish star near the object I wanted to view. So I resorted to the old method of sighting along the very long tube and star hopping to my targets.

First off was the Double cluster. A comfortable height and easily found. It showed the two clusters nicely within the Tak 24mm FOV. Image was a little dim due to the aperture and fl but the key members were there and some colour evident in the red/orange stars.  This prompted

 me to have a look at some colourful doubles.

Almach. A nice easy split in both eyepieces and showing the colours nicely. Stars in this scope show as nice pin sharp points of light and this gave a pleasant image.

Albireo was a strain to find due to its altitude but worth the effort with striking colours.

As the scope was pointing high up I went for Epsilon Lyra. After a few misses I found it and was presented with a nice wide split on the 2 main components but the wind and wobbly mount  made trying to split at 70x impossible, ah well next time.

Alcor Mizar was a must and all components were easily visible, you could drive a bus through the separation.

I then moved on to a couple of globulars. M13 was a nice size at 50x but only the outer stars were resolvable with either eyepiece. M15 was a nice tight globular and showed a bit brighter than M13.

M31 was a must, with M32 easily viewed and after a bit of searching I detected a faint M110, but the general view was OK for a 3.25"

M57, I found straight away and showed as a nice smoke ring against a dark background.

M27 was a struggle to find but I got there in the end and was pleased to see the familiar dumbbell shape easily instead of just a smudge.  

M45 with the 24 mm Tak was showing a part of the cluster only and it was a pleasure to wander around the cluster with the blue white stars showing as nice pin points.

Similarly I wandered along the Coat Hanger asterism with the 24mm.

I was concerned about the scope performance when I tested the optics with a cheshire eyepiece which showed a slight collimation issue which I could not adjust due to the non collimeatable cell. However this dark skies test showed that the scope has promise.

The next test will be with it bolted to a more substantial mount then I can do proper planetary testing with it. I always enjoy being able to get out under a dark sky and do old fashioned manual  astronomy.     

The scope with Jupiter in the background. The dew shield was robbed from a dead Konus 90mm for the purpose of the test and bodged on with a bit of sticky.

Hi Patrick.

This scope gives good intra and extra focal discs and sharp in focus stars, thats what puzzles me because the cheshire eyepiece test shows slight misalignment. I suspect the long FL of F16 is more forgiving of slight alignment problems.

This was a resto project I sold at auction earlier this year to fund this James Smith. It was a Broadhurst Clarkson 3" Starboy but engraved Franks. BC often supplied to dealers that way.

It was a handsome scope had a few issues that required a bit of lathe work but it worked well. I imaged the moon through it and it was quite useable.

Ive not been to Kelling for 4 years due to their rules. For years I had been going in my van, day van not full camper) then i tried to book again and they told me its not a camper van and wasnt allowed. I had a few conflicting issues with them the year before as well, they seemed to be determined to avoid a booking, so i dont bother niw.

8 hours ago, HAsun said:

Hello All,

I've been banned from booking a pitch because I sleep in my car, and they say it's not allowed. I've been going to Kelling since it was first based there after it moved from Thetford.  I have allways used my car and it's never been a problem before. The reason they have given me is that someone complained. obviously i'm most dissapointed by this decision, and thay are refusing to remove the ban. I'm now going to stay at Foxhills camping in weybourne, 2 miles down the road, and i'm hoping to pitch my large 150mm binoculars with someone, so I can observe from Kelling, hopefully !

I'm also wondering about the future of Kelling owing to the new management who seem to be totally unflexable with things. I've also spent many happy times there and i allways look forward to catching up with friends. Most dissapointed by this ridiculous decision by them.

 

I have used Foxhills Patrick. I was there in july this year actually. A great little place but be aware they arent providing shower facilities now. Loos, yes, showers no.

Hi Patrick. Yeah I saw the scope for sale awhile back, you also had the 3" BC Starboy on modded eq3, do you still have that?

Interesting about the gregorian 5" is a decent size for one of those, how do you go about polishing the mirrors?

Thats nice Mike. We all have regrets over scopes we shouldnt have parted with, all part of the journey.

Theres something special about using vintage and antique gear for astro. Ok technology has made life easier these days but just taking a step back ovcassionally and doing stuff the old way is refreshing and grounding.

A hobby of mine is restoring antiques and my favourite bit is antique scopes. I still regret selling my Fullerscopes 4" F15 Deluxe on antique Thos Cooke mount but moving house etc meant reducing STUFF so it had to go.

However, now that repairing the new house has slowed down a bit I can devote more time to my hobby so I thought you might like a butchers at the latest project. Its had me scratching my head a little

Its a 3.25" F16 (yes it is loooonnnngggg) Refractor. Tube is embossed James Smith London which dates it to before 1847 as Smith merged with Beck after that date to form Smith and Beck.

However, the objective elements are signed M Pillischer London on the glass edge. Moritz Pillischer was a instrument maker from 1849 to 1887 when Richard Pillischer took over.

So theres a conundrum, the dates dont match.

Therefore I reckon its a pre 1847 scope that was retrofitted with a Pillischer lens post 1849 but pre 1887. Perhaps that is when the tube was painted with the crinkle paint which I always thought to be a late 19th early 20c technique to cover poor quality tubes. Hmm

Most of it is fettled now but collimation is slightly out and its a non collimateable cell, so thats another puzzle for me to sort. Thats all part of the fun. However a star test the other night revealed good alignment so again I am puzzled. Not had chance to test it under a clear sky because we havent had one since I got it apart from 5 minutes the other night between clouds where I star tested it.

It came with a homemade accessory box containing 5 RAS eyepieces and a Prism diagonal and a well made but oddly designed tripod so a previous owner really cherished this scope.

I spent a few hours fettling the mount and scope on the lathe with bits of brass making a brass spindle which goes through the tripod head so you can unscrew the cabriole legs off the pillar and screw it on the field tripod as it should be. I then cut the odd wings off the tripod head and removed some very odd ali feet.

Still got to sort a spreader or chain, not made my mind up yet as to which way i will go. Plus stain the wood where ive had to cut and sand.

A handsome beast. Not as big as the 4" F15 (Big Brassy) but commands a similar presence.

I have had an fs60c for just over a year now and although I use it primarily for imaging, i do enjoy taking it out for a bit of visual. I have had many scopes over the years and this little scope has impressed me. It may be a 60mm but the views are crisp and clear. As a wide field visual scope its good but I have the extender which makes it a bit more versatile.

The silver lenses are for a camera, e.g. Zorki, Fed, Zenit. You wont be able to use them as eyepieces.

On 27/01/2015 at 11:36, Astrobits said:

The RAS thread is BSP ( British Standard Pipe ) so just get a couple of bits of pipe and find someone who could turn one bit down to 1 1/4" push fit.

Nigel

I know this is an old thread (no pun intended) but just for info RAS thread is 1 1/4" 16 tpi BSP threads are 11 tpi.

So RAS is not BSP.

They look similar and you may be able to force the threads together (cross threading and possible damage) but they arent the same.

I am in the process of making a couple of adapters at the moment and found this thread again whilst checking.

Sad news, my condolences to Johns family. I remember buying a scope off him some years ago and collecting it from his home. Nice chap, we had a good chin wag.

Plug the ferrite block end of the cable in at the handset. My cable has the same rj45 plugs at each end so is reversible. If its at the handset end it will mot snag, mine never has and Ive had it for years.

Doh, just reread the thread and realised you already spotted this. Glad your sorted

Plug the ferrite block end of the cable in at the handset. My cable has the same rj45 plugs at each end so is reversible. If its at the handset end it will mot snag, mine never has and Ive had it for years.

Makes you wonder what mark up they have on the bike next to it.

Straight through, aching back terratory

Still a big favourite scope of mine, 80mm f15 towa 339 heavily modified and modernised Just looks classy in my eyes

Been watching it. Thats my old one which I restored some years ago. A lovely scope. The views gave me a healthy respect for what you can see with a 60mm

Very Spielberg

A 6" newt astrograph slipping from the faulty mount clamp and bouncing off the concrete patio.

Next doors cat sitting on the wall of my open ROR observatory unbeknown to me. I got up to sort the camera out only to be tapped on the head by the cat. That made me jump.

A fox barking the other side of the observatory wall.

Very much so, I have the series 1 Tak 24mm and 7 mm MC LE eyepieces and am impressed with them