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First "Serious" Telescope - Dobs vs Newt?

fox2319

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fox2319

fox2319

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I'm looking into buying a semi-serious scope for some backyard astronomy with an option to put in a boot (occasionally) and travel to somewhere a bit darker. Mainly just seeing what's out there but with the option of taking some simple photos of the moon, planets and maybe just see how far it could go. So far, I've had a look at the Skywatcher telescopes on the FLO website and making an ever-expanding wish list.

If buying right now, I'd be looking at something like the Skywatcher Explorer 200P-DS OTA on an EQ-5 mount or maybe the Skywatcher Skyliner 250px FlexTube Dobsonian. I've been told the Dobs will be unsuitable for photo work as they're using an alt-az mount) and that I should look at something like the HEQ5 mount as a minimum. For this, I'd probably put off any purchase for a month or two.

Any advice on what would be the best kit to start with?

Thanks

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fox2319

fox2319

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Yes I agree with Charl on that one but the heq5 might be worth holding out for.

Looking at the price difference, that's around £500 extra and would probably mean delaying a few months (at least). What advantages would having the HEQ5 give me? From reading a bit of background, I understand it gives me tracking / goto and is a bit more solid. 

If it makes any difference, I've got an EOS-70D camera so it's about mid-weight.

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brantuk

brantuk

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"Any advice on what would be the best kit to start with?"

Always hard to judge the answer to this for any individual new starter. But based on your OP I'd suggest a 150P (or PDS) on EQ5 with tracking motors to start off with. Get one second hand in good working order to save pennies - it's a popular combination that can easily be sold on later, and it'll give you opportunity to dabble with imaging and observing in the meantime.

Trouble with the 200PDS on EQ5 is that by the time you add guide scope, cameras, dew control, tracking, and all the other stuff you'll need - the rig will be at max or overweight for the mount. Once you have enough funds to pop it on an HEQ5 you can sell the 150/EQ5 with minimum loss and it'll give you spare cash towards the imaging stuff you'll want to buy. It's vital to keep underweight for the mount - the mount is perhaps the most important part to get right. Hth :)

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fox2319

fox2319

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"Any advice on what would be the best kit to start with?"

Always hard to judge the answer to this for any individual new starter. But based on your OP I'd suggest a 150P (or PDS) on EQ5 with tracking motors to start off with. Get one second hand in good working order to save pennies - it's a popular combination that can easily be sold on later, and it'll give you opportunity to dabble with imaging and observing in the meantime.

Trouble with the 200PDS on EQ5 is that by the time you add guide scope, cameras, dew control, tracking, and all the other stuff you'll need - the rig will be at max or overweight for the mount. Once you have enough funds to pop it on an HEQ5 you can sell the 150/EQ5 with minimum loss and it'll give you spare cash towards the imaging stuff you'll want to buy. It's vital to keep underweight for the mount - the mount is perhaps the most important part to get right. Hth :)

Thanks. Aside from ebay, is there a go to site for good second hand kit?

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Gazabone

Gazabone

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As with anything there's pro and cons of both. I've taken planetary images that have at least pleased me with a non tracking mount however (imho) deep sky is a complete non starter with a Dob mounted scope. The problem with photography on altaz is field rotation (ie when observing from Earth, the Stars motion is circular so over a period time, the image will appear to spin around). If deep sky is your aim then it's the eq5 head and shoulders above the Dob. It also has the advantage that you have options to find your targets that a basic altaz mount won't give you. The down side are that its much more cumbersome to set up, if you want to move it during your observing session you have to set it all up again and the position of your eyepiece might become awkward when pointing in some directions.

Whatever you choose, I hope you have a great and rewarding time with it

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BritAngler

BritAngler

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The HEQ5 comes between the EQ5 and NEQ6, so imagine something between the two :)

I'm happy enough plonking my 200P on the EQ5 even when I've got a DSLR attached to the eyepiece. Just make sure you have the thing balanced or you could damage the tracking motors.

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ollypenrice

ollypenrice

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The key thing, if you do go for an equatorial mount because you are tempted by deep sky imaging, is to get one capable of deep sky imaging. I wouldn't go below the HEQ5 and I wouldn't, for imaging, overload it. 150mm Newt as the max.

To be honest I would far rather observe with a Newt on a Dob mount than on an equatorial. It's quicker to set up, more intuitive, less contortion-inducing. You don't have to do a meridian flip (swapping scope and counterwights by rotation of the axes 180 as you go from east to west.) So if going for an EQ mount I'd be doing so only for imaging purposes in which case I'd want to be sure the imaging was going to happen and going to happen often enough to be worth it.

If you do go into DS imaging be warned. You'll soon want a coma corrector, and autoguider and, maybe, a psychotherapist!  :grin:

Olly

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Singlin

Singlin

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For Observing and Imaging I would save up and invest in the 250P and EQ6 mount.

Many people who buy the HEQ 5 end up buying the EQ6 later on.

With this combination you would have great observing and visual in one.

For both as Olly stated you wowuld need a coma corrector.

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Chris

Chris

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For Observing and Imaging I would save up and invest in the 250P and EQ6 mount.

Many people who buy the HEQ 5 end up buying the EQ6 later on.

With this combination you would have great observing and visual in one.

For both as Olly stated you wowuld need a coma corrector.

Hmmm I don't know? I once had a smaller 200p on an HEQ5 and found it very awkward just mounting the OTA. Then there was the need to keep on rotating the OTA every object you look at, if you don't you'll get a bad back in no time. I can only imagine this would be even more awkward with a 10" Newt/NEQ6 setup, impressive yes, but practical?

For AP it wouldn't be the most beginner friendly focal length, and a big 10" would also catch the wind terribly, these are two points which are not kind to the all important tracking accuracy.

I'd think about having a dedicated easy to use visual scope, then look at a beginner friendly AP rig after that if it was me :)  

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ollypenrice

ollypenrice

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Hmmm I don't know? I once had a smaller 200p on an HEQ5 and found it very awkward just mounting the OTA. Then there was the need to keep on rotating the OTA every object you look at, if you don't you'll get a bad back in no time. I can only imagine this would be even more awkward with a 10" Newt/NEQ6 setup, impressive yes, but practical?

For AP it wouldn't be the most beginner friendly focal length, and a big 10" would also catch the wind terribly, these are two points which are not kind to the all important tracking accuracy.

I'd think about having a dedicated easy to use visual scope, then look at a beginner friendly AP rig after that if it was me :)

The suggestion to go for a visual Dob and a small imaging apo or camera/lens tracking system (Astrotrack, Sky Adventurer, Polarie etc) often comes up as an alternative to the probably impossible 'one scope for all purposes.' I think 'Dob plus small imaging rig' really is the best bet.

Olly

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Singlin

Singlin

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Dob, EQ5 and ED 80 sounds good too.

The advantage of having one and the other is that you can be imaging and doing visual at the same time.

I have had no problems using my 250 Newt on an Equitorial mount for visual , neither have my clients.

Collimating the 250P is easier than my Quattro F4 but still is a task that has to be mastered.

Starting out I would probably advise on a Dob and Eq5 with a ED 80 and DSLR for imaging.

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GeoffB

GeoffB

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Hi I must admit I went for the 200pds Explorer a a I want to get into imaging in tje future I regret not having the bottle or the reddies to go for either the neq6 or heq5 mounts but I just did not have the budget at the moment. The tubes light gathering potential is phenonminal tonight both my son and I were blown away by the sheer numbet of white dots we could see during the past 4hours we could see with our nked eye a few points of light and then with our 25mm we were completely gobsmacked by the sheer numbet of stars. We only used our 25mm as we are awaiting better lenses I am busy saving up for a good zoom and possibly a barlow to improve our magnification. Alas this is one expensive hobby my teenaged son decided to get us involved in but it brings into perspective how much is beyond our world and galaxy. If you can I would encourage you to hunt for a heq5pro at the very least the rewards are great.

I must admit due to the complete volume of stars even the finderscope finds I now find it difficult to be certain of where I am looking and have to get my self looking at the wider world without any scopes to get my bearings after using a small refractor the 200p ds is a giant leap forward. Don't be put off by its size but definitely ensure you get the best mount you can afford at the time. I regret not being able to get better than a cg5 non goto motorised mount but as we go to a dark site portability is also a major factor in our choices.

happy hunting because theres a lot to find both kit wise and looking skyward.

Geoff

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