Advice on what setup to get

[davemorl]

Hi everyone, I'm new to this forum and would just like to take a minute to say hello as this is my first post.

I am very new to astronomy and would like some advice. I've done a fair bit of reading and research and have already got some photography experience (canon 700d) but I'm very much a noob so please excuse my ignorance.

I am looking to image DSO such as galaxies and nebula I'm not to fussed about planets or the moon as such as of yet. I know I'm probably jumping in at the deep end and I'll probably sink before I float but I love a good challenge ha!

I was thinking of either a AVX or a HEQ5 both seem to have very good reviews and are capable of auto guiding if I ever want to upgrade.

The advice I really need is what OTA to get there are so many to choose from. I'm looking at spending 1500 overall so prob no more than 600/700 ish on the OTA.

I was thinking about the Skywatcher Quattro just because it's so fast. Please correct me if anything I have said is unsuitable or if you have any better suggestions?

Thank you in advance

Dave

[swag72]

The HEQ5 is a good mount and has been the basis of many peoples rigs. If you've not already done so, get a copy of 'Making Every Photon Count' from the book section of the FLO website. Something of an imagers bible, read it ........... twice ...... then again..... before you think of spending any money. By the end of a few reads you will know what you need and why it makes sense.

Here's the rub, based on nothing more than my own experience. AP is frustrating as hell, if it can go wrong then it will, so you want tools at your disposal that will make it as easy as possible. An ED80 refractor is that beast, Get the dedicated reducer as well and its a good flat field with your DSLR for minimal fuss. You'll be up and running in now time. The little refractor won't bother the mount either and it will happily buzz around all night in my experience. You don't want to be throwing away subs if you can help of it.

[iksose7]

Hi Dave and welcome!

First off, the HEQ5 is a great mount. If you can afford it, then thats a solid base for your OTA. You may never even have to upgrade to anything else.

As for the OTA, i would recommend a refractor. Much less maintenance and over all easier to use. And if you dont like star spikes like a lot of people (and me) then its the best route to take. Your budget of £600-700 would get you a nice ED80 which can produce stunning images. I'm sure the Quattro would also serve well but i wouldnt choose it just because its fast.

If you really want to jump into the deep end you could consider a small guiding package such as the Orion starshoot which will allow you to take longer exposures. But this may be a bit out of budget depending which OTA you go for.

If you are not put off by second hand gear you could keep an eye open on AstroBuySellUK. Plenty of great scopes going on there at nice prices.

Callum

[nightfisher]

Again another vote for the HEQ5, has a good payload and well proven, as for OTA, i would say either the ED80, or the 130pDS, this little newt is proving pretty good for imaging, though the ED80 will be less hassle

[ollypenrice]

The HEQ5 is good but...

1) Don't overlaod it. An 8 inch Newt is getting mighty close to what it can handle well. 

2) Autoguide it from the start. Autoguiding is something to get into from day one. It is the life blood of imaging. (So called 'unguided' mounts that cost a fortune are, in reality, guided on their own encoders.) In AP the mount is almost everything and the autoguider is part of the mount. Get in there, don't mess about.

The Quattro is hard work and is, though they don't tell you this, effectively a kit that you have to sort out yourself. Check out Singlin's threads on this, along with others. Once sorted it's good. How much sorting do you want?

There are at least two members posting stunning results from the 130PDS Newt which is a little slower, and slower means more tolerant. And then there's the slower but easier route of the little apo. This is where my own heart lies. In an endeavour in which things work if you're lucky a small apo can be one of those glorious miracles, something which just works and always just works.

Olly

http://ollypenrice.smugmug.com/Other/Best-of-Les-Granges/22435624_WLMPTM#!i=2266922474&k=Sc3kgzc

[Thalestris24]

Hi there

Personally, if I was starting again I'd probably go for the 130pds on an AVX But you have to budget for lots of extras such as guide camera, adaptors, coma corrector, cables, power supplies, dew prevention etc etc etc It can be a money pit! Fortunately, you can get by with free software

Louise

[skywatcher58gb]

Welcome Dave

I'll second what has been suggested, HEQ5 Pro with the Skywatcher ED80, this is my setup. I also have an ST80 with the QHY5 guide cam piggybacked onto the ED80 as a guide scope. One other advantage of the HEQ5 is if you can pick up a second hand 150mm Newtonian you can use this for visual observing. The HEQ5 and ED80 can be used for purely tracking astrophotography if you keep the exposure times short, say 60 to 90 seconds and will give passable results if well aligned. Also get the book as suggested, it's a really in depth introduction and is very easy to read without going too deep into theory. You will also need an imaging capture device, possibly a DSLR camera. So plenty to take in and I'm sure you will enjoy the challenge weather permitting.

Dave

[laser_jock99]

In experienced hands the Quattros (or equivalent GSO F4 models) can be a good scopes but not ones I would recommend for beginners. More of an upgrade for people that like to tinker than a starter scope!  I would go for the ED80 route or maybe the F5 130 or 150PDS (or GSO variants). As others have said an 8" scope might be overloading the EQ5 by the time you add a DSLR and secondary  guide scope.

[Tinker1947]

I would go with the HEQ5 mount as for a scope either the ED80 or a Reflector, for galaxies i would think the reflector would be the way to go, it has a more FL and is a bit faster, Nebular s the ED80 would win, so really if you want to do both you need 2 scopes....plus the extra's  a Reflector needs a Coma Corrector, a Refractor a Flatterner/reducer, both scope could do with some guiding, cheapest option use a Finder Scope and a CCD.....

[davemorl]

Wow, I didn't expect such an overwhelming response. Thank you.

I will get the literature ordered tonight and will look forward to giving it a good old study!

Hmm so the HEQ5 seems to be getting the majority of vote. What's the major reason for this?

Also I did look at the refractors they do seem alot less maintenance and you all have a very good point the last thing I want to do is have to mess about collimating and sicken myself. I'm sure the polar alignment and calibration will keep me very busy!

So will I struggle to image the majority if galaxies with an ED80? Or will it be possible just difficult?

I may see what spare change I have left over after all the extras and get an autoguider. They do seem pretty important especially DSO!

Thanks again

[Thalestris24]

Hi

If you want to get some idea of target image sizes, have a play with a fov calculator:

http://www.12dstring.me.uk/fov.htm

Louise

[davemorl]

That is a spot on site thank you! If I'm making images like what I'm seeing on that site then I'll be very happy with myself ha! I think I've got a long road ahead though before having the skill to produce anything decent but that's all part of the fun!

[Tinker1947]

Don't let Collimation put you off buy a Reflector, takes a minute or 2 with a laser collimator, just needs a little bit of thinking about, as to why you alter either secondary or the primary....easy peasie...... 

[davemorl]

Yeah I've watched a video on YouTube on it. To be honest it doesn't look too difficult at all with a laser collimating tool!

[Cpaulo]

I must say that the best thing I did was get the book "making every photon count". I read it a couple of times over, as has been suggested time and time again to all noobs starting out, and I go back over certain sections almost each night.

After a couple months of consideration I went out and bought the SW HEQ5 mount with a SW 80ED along with QHY5L I I guide camera. Just a few more bits to save up for.

I still want to get a reflector at some point but think that a good mount is always the starting point and the HEQ5 seems to tick all the boxes, I did look at the Celestron advanced VX with a slightly larger payload at 30lbs (15kg) opposed to the suggested 11kg imaging limit on the HEQ5 but the SW won out.

[Thalestris24]

I'd say the AVX can potentially perform better than the heq5 pro - it has servo motors with encoders and can be calibrated to minimise backlash and periodic errors. Maybe worth having a squiz at the manual:

http://www.celestron-nexstar.de/advanced_VX-Manual-F.pdf

Of course, the heq5 is a tried and tested workhorse.

Louise

[davemorl]

Can I ask why the HEQ5 won in the end? If it has a slightly lower payload capacity?

I think I've been sold on the ED80 I've been looking at the fov available through it and it seems exactly what I'm after. I may save up for a reflector in the mean time and get to grips with the ED80 first as well as see if it for me.

[davemorl]

Yeah louise that's exactly what I've been looking into. It seems like a lot more sophisticated mount but the HEQ5 seems to be the most popular. Is it just because it's been around longer? Or is it just personal preference?

Thanks

[Thalestris24]

Yeah louise that's exactly what I've been looking into. It seems like a lot more sophisticated mount but the HEQ5 seems to be the most popular. Is it just because it's been around longer? Or is it just personal preference?

Thanks

Hi

Yeah ithe Synta mounts been around quite a few years - the AVX is fairly new though an evolution of previous Celestrons, I think. The heq5 is well supported on here so has the collective experience and wisdom of many users herein. I have the heq5 syntrek so no synscan handset so I don't know what facilities are provided. It has it's foibles but on the plus side it's fairly easy to strip down and maintain. Belt drive mods are available for it. Also the heq5 is supported by eqmod (free mount control software). But they're both good mounts - I have an AVX also and like it though the servos are a bit whiney. I think the recommended imaging payloads are similar and such quoted values aren't totally strict, from what I've read. They are just suggested for reliable imaging but going slightly over doesn't mean they'll suddenly stop working! Bear in mind that neither are 'high end' mounts. But most beginners (sensibly?) don't want to fork out 0000's for mounts or scopes - though if I ever win the lotto...

Louise

[davemorl]

Yeah I have looked into the HEQ6 mount but to be honest I am struggling to justify more money into something that I may not use as much as I'd like to or that I loose interest in. I know in maybe a few years if I get the bug I will probably regret not forking out the few hundred more pounds but if I win the lotto this weekend I'll treat myself

I think I've definitely been swayed to get the ED80 to start off with but I'm still torn between the mount! I think it will be a flip of the coin at this rate ha!

[DaveS]

The HEQ5 is a mature well sorted mount that's well supported by largely free third-party software. Add a short FL apo and it's as near plug-and-play as you're going to get in AP. Most anything else is more like plug-and-pray. But as Olly said do budget for a ST80 and eg QHY5-II guide set-up, it really is key to getting long exposures.

[Thalestris24]

The heq5 syntrek is slightly cheaper than the AVX (at FLO) though the AVX comes with a proper hand controller - oh, and a two year warranty. Yep - toss a coin!

Louise

[davemorl]

Does the HEQ5 need the upgraded altitude and azimuth bolts? I remember reading somewhere that they were pretty poor? I will price up what I have left over and see what I can do with the guide scope, I would love to have one as it will definitely improve my imaging.

Thank you all for your advice you have all been very welcoming to ST.

[Thalestris24]

Hi

I have upgrade alt bots. The trouble with the supplied ones is that they are on the soft side and bend quite easily.  Maybe if you're careful with them then you might get away with not upgrading. The alt adjustment is rather crude, I'd say. Often people forget to loosen one before tightening the other... And maybe some heavy-handed people tend to overtighten them - resulting in bent and possibly stuck bolts.

Louise

[wxsatuser]

My starter kit is/was the HEQ5 and 80ED Pro.

Having never done AP and I was'nt a member here then, it was virtually plug and play.

I was doing upto 15minute subs and had very little experience of AP.

You will want a guiding setup, Ollys bang on, don't mess about if you want good results.

You will want lots of patience as well.