Advice on neighbours with (in)security lights

[kev100]

Hiya,

I'd appreciate any thoughts/experience regarding the issue of neighbours and their 'security' lights. I mainly observe in the village recreation ground right across from my house. It's a large field, with houses along two sides, but with a large and thick hedge around it. In the summer months this hedge blocks pretty much all light from a couple of security lights. Now, though, with the leaves falling off, I've had to seek out a spot that's out of the line of sight of the lights (which was fine). However, I went out last night to discover that one individual had trimmed the hedge at his end, and now his light shines right across the field.

I popped over and introduced myself, said what I was doing, and asked him if he wouldn't mind switching off the light for a while? 'How long' he replied (a little ill at ease), 'because we do like leaving it on because of the security ...'. 'A couple of hours?' I said. He was happy enough to do this (but didn't take up my offer of having a look through the scope as he was 'watching tv' ...). 

Anyway, almost exactly 2 hours later the light came back on (just as Orion was clearing the roof of his house!).

The question is, I suppose, how to I 'manage' this in the future. He's clearly a chap with 'insecurities'. Although he seemed happy enough to turn off the light last night, I didn't get the feeling that he'd be happy with me turning up frequently (and on an ad hoc basis determined by the weather/sky clarity/etc), and asking for it to be turned off time and time again. I don't really want to have to keep trotting over there, cap in hand, asking him to turn off his ridiculous light.

I had figured that my best course of action would be to set up a local club of sorts, so we could be a bit more organised, and it wouldn't just be me all the time. However, this is proving more difficult that I would ever have imagined.

Any thoughts would be most welcome.

Cheers,

Kev.

[Tonys]

I think it was a good idea to offer him a look through your scope, as it would put him at ease that you were genuine. Maybe next time you have a session planned you could go over during the daytime to let him know and repeat your offer. I don't know how you can avoid having to go over each time though, if there isn't any way to block the light.

[Dave Lloyd]

Tell him his light is a nuisance and to please take measures to restrict it to his own property.

[kev100]

Tell him his light is a nuisance and to please take measures to restrict it to his own property.

Hi Dave,

As tempting as this is, I'd prefer to avoid escalating this into a conflict

Kev

[swamp thing]

Just a gentle reminder fols.

Please keep your comments sensible, and please no suggestions of criminal damage or other ilegal activities. Thank you

[Scott]

could you use a large beach umbrella?

[DiamondSmiles]

I've got a guy similar to yours who will switch his security light on and off all evening (for his dog when he lets it out into his garden!). The light lit up the whole neighbourhood. On days when I wasn't viewing I would get my own back and switch on the powerful light on my power tank and direct it at his property all evening. Think he's getting the message now

[happy-kat]

I would use a mobile block so that it was nasked and no longer a light direct at your eyes perhaps something like a garden parasol with a stick and then a piece of stiff card.

[jamespels]

Hi Dave,

As tempting as this is, I'd prefer to avoid escalating this into a conflict

Kev

That said, you could ask him to pint it down a little. If you show willing, e.g. by standing in the field as he adjusts it down and saying "when", he may well go along with it. The aim, as you say, is to avoid conflict and work with your neighbours - chances are this chap is not too fussed about where his light gets aimed, so long as his garden is well lit and pointing it down a little may actually increase how bright his garden is by wasting less light.

Having the confidence to ask politely and be willing to work with people is most of the battle. Think about it from their point of view ... to them, there is some wierdo outside the back garden looking in the windows with a big telescope. As such, there is actually incentive to make it more difficult for you rather than less and you have to give them a reason to help you.

Another option is to get involved in a bit of local outreach - offer to take your scopes to the local schools, for instance, and put up a notice in the local shop / whatever inviting people to join you. Word will fairly quickly get round that you are an "all right" sort and you may even get a few more people out on the field for a bit of observing.

HTH, 

James.

[estwing]

Put your scope in your car and drive....

[glowjet]

Bit of a tricky one this, you seem to be observing from what must be deemed public open space, the village green. The householder will have every right to erect and secure his property with a security light. Without further information, it might be worth having a word with Chief Clerk to the committee which controls the local environment. The bordering hedge may just be the responsibility of the local parish, who own the land and your frontager may have cut what does not belong to him. The green is there for the pleasure and use by the villagers and your use of it is now being spoilt. The local powers that be, just might be persuaded to ask him to temporarily shield or adjust the light, until the hedge regrows, worth a try

[Mukv]

Greetings

make an offer to swap it for a PIR activated light he keeps his security and it helps you out.

Andy

[Dave In Vermont]

Offer red-light bulbs to hold-outs who are unwilling to honor your request. Being proactive works better than being reactive.

Clear & Dark Skies,

Dave

[nightfisher]

Put your scope in your car and drive....

Have to say but i tend to agree with this, its what i have to do if i want to do any thing other than Luna

[kev100]

Thanks everyone, lots of good advice there. I figured that, since these lights seem to be ubiquitous these days, someone was bound to have some experience with them.

I'm definitely going to try organising a group/some observing sessions. Hopefully the more people realise what a good spot we have here, it'll be easier to get the lights turned off when we need it.

Cheers,

Kev.

[niallk]

I feel your pain - in a similar situation myself in my previously nicely dark backgarden. I use a parasol on its side as a shield for direct glare, but still know it damages through peripheral vision. I need to make some sort of better screening - or I fear I'll be forced to go off in the car which is just not nearly as convenient for going for a look see. It's a real shame tis rare when weather is clear + kids asleep + wife happily watching telly or gone to bed + no moon... only for a halogen security light to ruin it all. Takes a lot of self control not to hurl a rock (kiddin)

[ronin]

Tell him his light is a nuisance and to please take measures to restrict it to his own property.

Doubt this is totally correct, his light is not shining on to the Kev's property but on to a public recreation ground/field.

Therefore it is not a nuisance by illuminating Kev's garden/property, Kev has in effect put himself in the area of illumination.

Doubt there is actually a lot that you can do or could get done, simply because the light is not effecting your property.

Mind you these days putting a bright light on all the time is costly, if however they are willing to accept the cost I cannot see there is a great deal you can do.

[Astrobits]

In The Campaign For Dark Skies book written by Bob Mizon there is an interesting comment from a burglar after being caught. From memory ( I don't have the book now ) it went like this:

The burglar was asked if "security" lights would help. He replied "Yes, it would enable me to get in and out quicker and not get caught"

As it is not the light itself that detects intruders and alerts the owner, perhaps you could ask him who he thinks is watching his garden 24/7? Does he watch his neighbour's gardens overnight?

As others have commented, most burglaries occur during the daylight so, logically, making the nightime as bright as daylight would INCREASE the chances of burglary.  The oposite effect, reducing nighttime lighting, has been shown to reduce crime in a number of studies.

Nigel

[Algieba]

I have the same problem! Usually I just go to the nearest field because my garden doesn't have the best seeing conditions anyway.

[Dave Lloyd]

A garden security light shining into a public area where I live used to be a positive hazard when it meant you couldn't see to put one foot in front of another. People were stumbling into a ditch adjacent to the path.

[philhas]

My guess the fact that the light came on after 2 hours means he is probably not interested in your hobby & didn't check to see if you had finished. You can try again however my gut feeling is as suggested get in you car and drive to where there is no problem

[Gadget]

It is a tricky one unlike a neighbor who you would be on friendly speaking terms with he probably sees you as some stranger coming onto his "manor" and telling to turn his lights off i think he has made his intentions clear just by putting them back on after the agreed time even though you were still viewing...... first time you caught him unprepared next time no doubt he will have a whole book of reasons why his precious light must stay on   just think you will need to find somewhere else 

Kev  

[michaelmorris]

One approach might to start writing short monthly articles on practical astronomy for the one thing almost everyone in a village always reads - the parish magazine.  Point out how lucky you all are compared to townies because you can actually see the night sky.  After 4 or 5 months, slip in an article about light pollution.

[happy-kat]

And how simple changes like aiming lights down wards to minimise light spill to surrounding areas. Like the idea on articles in the parish mag.

[kev100]

One approach might to start writing short monthly articles on practical astronomy for the one thing almost everyone in a village always reads - the parish magazine.  Point out how lucky you all are compared to townies because you can actually see the night sky.  After 4 or 5 months, slip in an article about light pollution.

Hiya Michael Morris.

That, sir, is a cracking idea. I'm gonna get on that. #genius  

Kev