My first attempt at astro photography

[vertigo262]

This is my first time with an SLR, tried a SLM before was a lot more difficult. 

I am using a advanced vx mount, lx80 6 inch SCT. Starsense  and a canon 7D

these are all on ISO 800 ranging from 1 - 10 minute exposures. they are all blury. I am trying to figure out if it is because my polar alignment, tracking, or focus is off. I tried taking a picture of Saturn and it was just a blurry ball, even with 10 second exposure. But I could not get the focus any better.

beginner tips would be helpful

[Hitesh]

Get yourself backyard eos that will help you frame and focus much better

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[Stargazer33]

Your Dumbbell Nebula shot and the last one look like you had a vibration issue. They are not just simple star trailing from poor polar alignment. Is the mount on a stable surface? Are you walking around the mount whilst the exposure is running?

The other shots don't seem to be showing star trailing or vibration, just inacurate focus. APT has a good focus aid and a Bartinov mask focus aid which are both very good and easy to use. It is free to use but a donation if you like the software is always a good idea as it helps the developer to continue to improve their software for the benefit of us all.

Despite the obvious problems they are very good shots btw. Well done. I hope you get things sorted out.

Edit: btw, 10 seconds on Saturn is a long exposure, I'm not surprised you just got a blob. Try reducing your exposure time for planets, they are quite bright compared to nebulae.

[vertigo262]

The mount was on dirt, but seemed pretty stable. I was sitting in a chair maybe 10 feet away, and the dumbell nebula was a pretty long exposure if I recall.

also, what I've been doing for focus, is on alignment, I point it to polaris, and focus until polaris looks ok, then leave it there. I can't seem to see well in the LCD, or looking through the lens. I could try backyard eos, I'd have to bring a computer though.

I align my polar alignment with a polar scope, but, it must be off, I probably need to work on that but I don't know how you could really get that perfect because after about 2 minutes of exposure, I start to notice the blurring

[VigdisVZ]

Not bad, see if you can mirror-lock or delay exposure. Keep subs shorter, try 30sec to 1 min and stack those, those objects dont need that much, and unless you're using a guidescope, anything over 2 minutes is risky at best. Except saturn, you might better be able to film saturn, preferably in crop-mode or with a smaller camera like a webcam.

Using a mask or zoomed live-view for focus will help. If that doesnt help you might need to check into collimation.

Look into doing drift alignment, if you dont want to do a precise polar-scope alignment.

Keep up the good work!

[ollypenrice]

As the others have said, focus and tracking. When the trailing of the stars makes a wiggly line as in the Dumbbell the mount must have taken a bump.

The glob has normal tracking error (polar alignment and autoguiding are needed) and the Lagoon is well tracked but not in focus.

Don't panic, these things take a while to sort. You really do need assisted focus, accurate polar alignment (eg drift method) and an autoguider, especially for your kind of focal length.

Are you using the F6.3 flattener-reducer? This would be a big help, too.

Olly

[szymon]

Very good for a first try if you ask me!

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[swag72]

Definite focus issue in a couple - You could try a Bahtinov mask, this is a real boon for focusing and takes any guess work out if it.

[x6gas]

Yes a variety of issues but you'll get there.

I second Sara's suggestion of a Bahtinov mask - takes the guess work out of focusing and will massively improve your results.  I've seen similar shapes as your Dumbbell as a result of a combination of drift from poor polar alignment and poor RA tracking due to the Periodic Error of the mount.

At the focal length of your SCT you won't be able to get very long exposures with your mount.  Guiding is pretty much inevitable for deep sky astrophotography with your gear but then the universe is your oyster!

[vertigo262]

Thank you.

I will research drift alignment, and I have ordered a focal reducer, but I haven't received it yet, so this is without one. I will also look into Baackyard eos. Just concerned that a laptop battery won't last more then a couple of hours, then I would need to figure out if I could plug it into my power tank

[Rudeviewer]

Do not walk by your mount while you are imaging.  I learned this no matter if it is in dirt or on cement It will take the movement and transfer it to the image.  Good start though.  Get a Bahtinov for sure.

[jtlandreneau]

+1 on the Bahtinov suggestion. Are you autoguiding? I struggled to get greater than 30 second steady exposures before attaching the Orion SSAG (I never drift align though, I'm sure a dedicated drift alignment session would help dramatically)

[Quatermass]

First shots and first attempts are always the most exciting time of doing astrophotography a very nice collection of targets there and you will enjoy doing these all over again in a few years time if you stick at it. Focusing is way better using a laptop and backyard eos and a bahtinov mask in fact I would never be without those two now. If your just starting choose bright easy subjects like clusters and bright nebula rather then the harder fainter ones and try sticking with short subs of 70 80 seconds but take lots of them about 60 or 80 with the same of darks flats and bias shots. The real challenge is going to be the processing side of things but sticking to one subject at a time is a good idea as its tempting to try for more and that usually ends up getting frustrating. Above all enjoy yourself.

[vertigo262]

So I went out tonight, with your advice

At first, I did not want to take a laptop because I didn't want so much gear. After using stellarium on my laptop with backyard EOS, I am hooked. Before I was just using Skysafari. Now I don't want to go without a laptop.

I also messed around with PEC, although I still have not taken the time to learn how to drift align. 

You were right, the focusing is a lot easier using backyard EOS, although, in live view, I can't see much.

Also, since the last shots, I bought a Focus Reducer f/6.3

This seemed to help a lot. My shots are still blury, and I noticed when stacking I had to align. So my polar alignment is still off and I need to learn how to drift align.

This is my first attempt at stacking, and I only did about 5 shots of each to learn.

Dumbell nebula 1 - 5 x 100 sec ISO 800

Lagoon Nebula1 5 x 120 sec ISO 800

Lagoon Nebula2  5 x 90 sec ISO 800

Polaris 1 frame   40 sec ISO 800

I left tonight extremely happy as things are starting to make sense. This was my 10th time out, and had been struggling. My next step is to work on Drift Alignment to try to get some clarity.

Thanks for everyones help so far as I am really liking this.

[VigdisVZ]

Good progress. Are you guiding? Because 100sec subs unguided are very difficult to pull off consistently.

[vertigo262]

i am using a starsense on a advanced vx mount, so the starsense is guiding, but I have no clue how well it works compared to the autoguiders

[VigdisVZ]

I think the starsense helps you setting up PA, not sure on that however.

If it was guiding, you shouldn't see star trails to that degree. Try lowering exposure times and bumping ISO just to see the difference.

Keep up the good work!

[jtlandreneau]

those are much better! how are you post processing the pictures?

[vertigo262]

I stacked them in photoshop. Flattened the layers, then messed with the levels multiple times, then did a little noise removal per each image.

the master files have a good amount of noise. I'm Assuming that is because I only stacked 5 images and need a lot more if I ever wanted print quality. would be nice to do a lower ISO, but it looks like I will need some really good PA for that

[vertigo262]

Hi Vigdisvg,

here are some 10 second, 6400 tests

[jtlandreneau]

I was going to say, the previous ones look a little over processed, these latest look like the could use a little bit more.

The advice i was given were two things - don't blowout the highlights when stretching, and dont make the darks completely black. should be aiming for 10-20 RGB in the dark regions

[vertigo262]

ok, this was my first stacking attempt. I have clue about processing. And I noticed the flats, bias, lights, darks, etc. these all confuse me. don't know what all that is for.

I sort of cranked the colors out of it, but I guess I lost the blacks.

Once I practice drift alignment and get longer exposures, or less blury ones, i can work on the processing side of it all.

[x6gas]

I think you're making excellent progress - well done.

[vertigo262]

this is interesting. I downloaded DeepSkyStacker and redid the Lagoon Nebula

Looks much better except the noise. But I need good polar alignment, and a low iso, and lots of images to stack I guess

[jtlandreneau]

I don't know Vertigo, I think you got a lot of the data there... I think you are just over processing it. The blacks seem a too black, and the whites a bit blown out. definitely getting better though!